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  • Relationships!

    Here's my Baker family in 1851 -


    This information Crown Copyright, from The National Archives

    My 3x great grandparents were Abraham Baker (born 1800 Horsted Keynes, Sussex) and Lydia Nicholls (born 1808 Battle, Sussex), who married in Horsted Keynes on 30th March 1831. Eliza (1842), Olivia (1845) and George (1850) are 3 of their 7 children.

    Lydia Nicholls was the daughter of Thomas Nicholls (born 1780 East Grinstead, Sussex) and Lydia Ede (born 1786 Sussex) who married in Hurstpierpoint, Sussex, on 30th January 1807.

    Susannah is Abraham's mother. She had married his father William Baker in Horsted Keynes on 17th April 1798. William must have died by 1823 as she married Edward Tullett on 26th April 1823 in Fletching, Sussex.

    With these relationships in mind, why is Edward calling his step son, Abraham his son in law, and his step grandchildren nieces and nephews??

    Please help me unravel this one

  • #2
    Velma,

    In my experience it was quite common in the C19 for the term "son-in-law" to be used when we would now call him the "step son". As for more complicated relationships they often used terms like "cousin" rather loosely so that may explain the use of "niece" and "nephew" in your census.

    Peter

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    • #3
      Thanks for that Peter, I think you could be right

      Both Edward & Abraham were humble ag labs, and most probably uneducated, so perhaps didn't understand the correct relationship to state

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      • #4
        Velma if you take it literally son in law could be correct, at that time. As they are married he is a son in the eyes of the law. Just like you get a MIL amd FIL when you marry.
        Kit

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        • #5
          Thanks Kit, yes I think that's right, although the nieces and nephews bit is completely wrong, or is it?

          A lady has recently contacted me and has suggested that Abraham and Lydia were step-siblings. One of their children's birth cert's said formerly 'Nicholls', which she said suggests that she was married before, and hence the different surname, but I cannot see any evidence of that...

          I don't seem to have the 1861 on file - can someone find that for me please, as I don't have Ancestry anymore...

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          • #6
            Velma, be thankful you don't have the scenario that the Italians have! - The word for "grandson, granddaughter, niece and nephew" is the same (although the gender should be obvious!!).
            Elizabeth
            Research Interests:
            England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
            Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

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            • #7
              Originally posted by Velma Dinkley View Post

              A lady has recently contacted me and has suggested that Abraham and Lydia were step-siblings. One of their children's birth cert's said formerly 'Nicholls', which she said suggests that she was married before, and hence the different surname, but I cannot see any evidence of that...
              Velma,
              The use of the term formerly means 'nee'. We have just had this debate on another thread on the adoptions board. People checked their birth certs and confirmed that where a mother had been married before it said 'formerly' for her birth name and 'late' for her previous married name.
              Hope that helps.
              Margaret

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              • #8
                Have PM'd you Rachel.
                Daphne

                Looking for Northey, Goodfellow, Jobes, Heal, Lilburn, Curry, Gay, Carpenter, Johns, Harris, Vigus from Cornwall, Somerset, Durham, Northumberland, Cumberland, USA, Australia.

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                • #9
                  Geordiegirl,

                  Have you posted this on the wrong thread? I can see no-one called Rachel here. In any case it looks like whispering in front of others.

                  Peter

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Peter Evans View Post
                    Geordiegirl,

                    Have you posted this on the wrong thread? I can see no-one called Rachel here. In any case it looks like whispering in front of others.

                    Peter
                    No worries Peter

                    Velma is my user name on this site, Rachel is my real one - members who have corresponded with me in the past (such as geordiegirl) know this, when unfortunately you didn't.

                    I asked if someone could look at the 1861 census for me and that's what geordiegirl did and why she pm'd me.

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                    • #11
                      Thanks to Daphne (aka geordiegirl) I now have an image of the 1861 which further complicates matters -

                      "This information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk"

                      Abraham is now described as 'inmate', which I know can mean a lodger. However, his wife and children are those of the head of the household!!

                      So perhaps they didn't understand the relationship question on census night, although I think they really mean that they are the wife and children of Abraham :D

                      Thanks for your help Daphne

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