Elizabeth Rowland - Do I Take Her?

[Icklec]

Hi Everyone

My great great grandmother was Elizabeth Rowland born 1864c in Rotherham, South Yorkshire. She 'married' my great great grandfather, Walter King (I say married, but no marriage record has ever been found).

Walter is on the 1881 census as widowed with a son James in Parkgate, Rotherham. His 1st 'wife' Elizabeth Wilson died in 1881, she was buried on the 20th March 1881 at St Thomas, Brightside in Sheffield aged 39. There is also no marriage of Walter to Elizabeth Wilson. The son, Thomas, was born 14th August 1879 and was buried aged 4 at St Thomas, Brightside.

Walter and second 'wife' Elizabeth are on the 1891 (as Ring) with daughter Eliza born 1885c and son Albert born 1890. I have the birth certificates of their children Ernest born 1893 and William (my great grandfather) born 1909 in Sheffield. Both certificates have Elizabeth King formerley Rowland as the mother.

Because I have no marriage certificate for Walter to the second Elizabeth, I dont know who her father is. There is an Elizabeth Rowland on the1871 census in Rotherham and born Kimberworth (which is in Rotherham) with parents Robert & Lydia.

My dilema is, even though birth year and place match my Elizabeth, should I claim her without any kind of proof it is the correct Elizabeth?

Any idea are greatly received.

Regards
Claire

[Sherbertrose]

Hi Claire,

Are you sure that your great, great grandmother was born in Rotherham. If wife number one died in Sheffield 1881 and the children of wife number two were also born in Sheffield is it possible that she also came from Sheffield. I am wondering if James was staying in Parkgate for a while on bereavement of his 'wife'.

I often go to Rotherham Archives as I work in Rotherham and I could look for a marriage for you. However, in order to do this I would need some idea of which Parish or Parishes to look at. And of course if she came from Sheffield and married there, there would be no records in Rotherham.

Sandra

[Icklec]

Hi Sandra

Thats the problem, I am not 100% sure she is born in Rotherham. I have her with Walter on the 1891 census where she says born Rotherham. On the 1901 she states Sheffield and on the 1911, she has put Botham Street, Sheffield. So far, I have been unable to find where a Botham Street was.

Looking at the 1871 and 1881 censuses, I could only find the Elizabeth Rowland on the 71 in Kimberworth who fitted age wise and place but thats not to say there are others that are mis-transcribed.

I dont believe Walter and Elizabeth ever married even though they said they were. I also dont believe Walter and the first Elizabeth married even though he said he was a widow on the 1881. I have gone through bmd's and found nothing at all to suggest they married.

I really dont know where to go from here to trace her further back. I havnt found a death for her either.

Regards

[margaretmarch]

I was looking at the 1881 entry for Walter and he's not in Rotherham he's in Brightside Brierlow Sheffield with the Wilson family, presumably relatives of first wife Elizabeth.
On that he says he is born Parkgate Yorkshire - not sure where that is.
On the 1881 he says he was born Huddersfield and Elizabeth shows born Rotherham. Have you got the right people here?
the references I'm looking at are
1881 RG11; Piece: 4664; Folio: 42; Page: 25
1891 RG12; Piece: 3829; Folio 137; Page 9
Also what happened to the son James? You mention a son Thomas b1879 and dying 1883 but he isn't showing on the census for 1881.
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

Right just had a look on google and Parkgate is Rotherham.
However I had a look at 1861 to see if I could see Walter and there is one living with his parents in Parkgate, Almondbury which I see on google is in Huddersfield!!
So most likely just a different interpretation of an answer to the question 'where were you born?'
Not sure now where Rotherham might come in with all this
Margaret

[Icklec]

Hi Margaret

I have made a right mess of my original message :(
I meant to say Walter was in Sheffield in 1881 and born Parkgate. Parkgate is a district of Almondbury near Huddersfield. Confusing as there is also a Parkgate in Rotherham.

Also, the son James is the boy that died aged 4. I have written Thomas by accident as I was writing about St Thomas, Brightside Church lol.

Hope that has clarified things a little

[Sherbertrose]

Hi Claire,

I have just googled Botham Street it still exists. It is in the firth Park, Grimethorpe area of the city. This is close to Brightside - all the areas merge. It was the steel making area of the city.

Sandra

[Icklec]

Hi Sandra

Thanks for that. I grew up in Firth Park and I have never heard of it lol. That makes things confusing now, three census, one says Rotherham and two are Sheffield.

With no marriage, does anyone know of any other possible way I could find out who the father or both parents are of Elizabeth?

Many thanks for helping

[vikki brace]

You could try tracing the (possible) parents and see if they had any other children and try looking for a will, maybe her and her family are mentioned. Other the that I can't think of anything - sorry

[Icklec]

Hi Vicky

That sounds a good idea. I will try have a look for deaths of Robert & Lydia. What is the best way to look for wills? Is it just writing to that address in York where you pay £5? That would mean I have to purchase a death certificate for Robert?

Many thanks

[vikki brace]

Hi Claire

Try documents online, they do have quite a few alternatively give the local records office a call they might be able to help there.

Wills are really hit and miss but good luck

[Icklec]

Thanks Vicky
I will look in to this avenue more.

Kind Regards