Mary pike 1912

[kellycook]

PLEASE help ?

my gt aunt MARY WEBB/PIKE born 1912,regestered, webb then re regestered in pike (born out of wed lock) father george pike. 1d 26 lambeth
married a NICHOLAS TAYLOR in 1932 1d 1480 camberwell
Nick then died 1933.
Mary remarried 1943 to HENRY WARREN (bat) born 1899, marriage, 1d 897
MARY died in 1947 1d 388 camberwell
right now
i am unable to find HENRY'S birth as there was no father on there marriage cert.
and there was a child callled JEAN WARREN known as jeannie, i donot think she was Mary's child as my nan told my mum she was barron,
i dont think that she was HENRYS child as he wasent married before his marriage to mary,
i think that she was born about 1934/39 ish as my uncle can remember her quite well, and also said when mary died he was told by the family to take jeanie and move away they lived in dulwich and then moved to camberwell,
my uncle did go and see them there,
HENRY used to go every day to the tower of london, and used to tie his self up in chains and then get out of them, and earnt alot of money,

any help would be so appreciated

kelly

[margaretmarch]

Who are the witnesses on the marriage certificate? Henry could have had Jean as a child out of wedlock and for some reason had her to live with him and Mary. Have you found a birth record for Jean?

[AlanC]

There are quite a few Henry's in 1901 census to look at and one of them might just ring a distant bell ??

[kellycook]

mary webb and henry warren

hi thank you for your reply

in the presence of E DEAN and J E KEYS

and no i havent found JEAN'S birth this is what i am searching for ? they lived at 204 crystal palace rd east dulwich, london s.e.22
if there wasent such an age gap i would say JEAN may have been his sister ?

hope this may help

regards

kelly

[margaretmarch]

There are any number of J* W* births in 1935 to 1940 (I have left out the full name as she may still be alive) but you would need to find out which registration district covered the address you have in order to narrow down which one it might be.
Have you got Mary's death certificate? that would show who registered her death and maybe give you another clue to follow.
Margaret

[kellycook]

hi yes i have and its henry warren widow

and it was camberwell district, in london, my uncle knows that henry came from london.

thank you for your time

kelly

[margaretmarch]

Have you found Henry's death as his cert might be helpful?
If their address was in the Camberwell District you could look again at the J* W* births and select those that are registered in Camberwell or nearby as a start.
Is it possible that Jean was adopted by Henry and Mary if Mary couldn't have children. If that's the case you wouldn't find her birth under the surname W*.
Margaret

[kellycook]

ho yes never even thought about adoption ? how stupid am i, and no i havent found his death,
the only thing i really know about him is he used to go to the tower of london, and tie his self in chains and then get out of them, and earned lots of money, my mum can remember seeing him when she worked in the minories, so that would be in the sixtys so i will look for his death, although a am not alot of good doing this ? would there be any way i could find an adoption record ?
my regards and thanks
kelly

[tessie31082]

'legal' adoptions/adoption records didn't start until 1927 I think (someone else may be able to confirm this).

[kellycook]

hi thank you i think it would have been about 1934/7 ish, please can you tell me how to find this list ?

regards

kelly

[margaretmarch]

I don't think you can find anything about an adoption they are confidential to the people concerned.
I think the only thing you can really do at the moment is find Henry's death.
It's going to be a hard slog as you will have to trawl the death indexes back from 1983 quarter by quarter as they are not digitised between about 1911 and 1983.
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

I found this in the post-1984 death index
Henry Warren
Birth Date: 15 Feb 1898
Death Registration Month/Year: Sep 1991
Age at death (estimated): 93
Registration district: Lewisham
Inferred County: London
Volume: 14
Page: 419
Is it possible is could be him? Would his address in Camberwell have come under that district? You could phone the local Register Office and ask them.
I was thinking if your mum saw him in the 60s still chaining himself up he would have been about 60 years old then so maybe lived a long life. He would have been fit wouldn't he??
Margaret

[margaretmarch]

By the way how do you know he was born in 1899?
Margaret

[kellycook]

hey thank you yes i do think this is him, when i got there marriage cert it said he was 44 yrs in 1943 so i went back from there, yes my uncle can still remember him, and he was so very fit, my uncle said he was such a lovely man yet the family couldnt stand him, i think he was of mixed race, on there marriage cert he had no fathers name on it, and he adored mary
thank you so very much, i am still going on to find J as it will complete a saga ha
what a shame my uncle is now 72 and i know would have loved to have seen him again.

kelly x

[kellycook]

hye just a thought do you think he lived with J in lewisham, and lewisham is only a few miles from dulwich camberwell,

[margaretmarch]

Well he might have done. I would check first with the Lewisham Register Office if they cover Camberwell and then if you think that cert is him then order it. It costs £7 and you can do it online here General Register Office (GRO) - Official information on births, marriages and deaths.
Hopefully the person who reported his death will be J but if not maybe someone else who might know where she is or something about her that will help find her. But in any event you will get the last address for him so that might help.
Oh just had a thought - the address in Dulwich would it have been owned by Henry? if so you could check the land registry to see who owns it now.
Margaret
PS he may have been in sheltered housing by the time of his death so not where he was living when your uncle used to visit.

[kellycook]

no they didnt own there home, i have been trying to ring the gro but cannot them,
its so very frustrating when you know someone is there but you just cannot find them ?
thank you so much for your very kind help
my regards
kelly x

[margaretmarch]

If you think that's Henry's death then one of these could be his birth
Henry Warren
1898 Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Bethnal Green
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1c
Page: 252
and
Henry Warren
1898 Jan-Feb-Mar
District: Bethnal Green
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1c
Page: 269
Margaret

[kellycook]

henry warren

hi margaret

thank you very much, i am going to order a certificate for him, as i really do think that this is him,
thanks again for your help
my regards
kelly x:D