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Identity fraud etc - GERLACH

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  • Identity fraud etc - GERLACH



    What a mess!

    My husband's maternal grandad changed his name by deedpoll on the 7th April 1919 to James Leopold Gilbert. Prior to this he got married in 1900 to Jane Hanewell and was known at this time as Leopold Gerlach (age 21). His service record also gives his name as Leopold Gerlach with a birth date of 1879.

    Now Leopold had a brother called Otto Gerlach, dob 25 Aug 1879. This birth Certificate shows Otto's father as Philipp Gerlach and mother as Louise Gerlach formerly Gerlach.

    According to the London Gazette for the 2nd May 1919 it starts off Notice is hereby given that James Gilbert heretofore called and known by the name of Otto (but more commonly Leopold) Gerlach of 15 Langdon Road, Highgate, a natural born British Subject and lately serving in France as Private Leopold Gerlach etc etc............

    I have Otto's birth certificate and it shows that it was used as an exhibit for the change of name. The real Otto didn't die until 1934.

    The 1881 census shows Otto as being 10 and Leopold 11 but even this census form is strange as it shows the male and female boxes as being crossed off for them.

    Has anyone got any ideas why it appears Leopold used his brothers birth certificate? I certainly can't find a birth certificate for Leopold. It has been suggested that Leopold was actually quite a bit older. Why wouldn't he have a birth certificate.

    I'm sorry if this has left everyone confused but Leopold has really made my tree look a mess!!!

  • #2
    Do you think Leopold was actually NOT born in Britain? Perhaps he found it convenient to pretend to be Otto? How strange.

    Anne

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    • #3
      Well his mother and father got married in 1877 in the German Lultharian Church in Dalston. I wonder if he was born out of wedlock and in Germany?

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      • #4
        well, you know where he was born, so i'd start by checking the church the parents were married at.

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        • #5
          Originally posted by kylejustin View Post
          well, you know where he was born, so i'd start by checking the church the parents were married at.
          This is the problem - we don't! We know where his brother Otto were born. What was the big secret with Leopold?

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          • #6
            Just been looking at the censuses. I presume you mean the 1891 census where Otto and Leopold are 10 and 11?

            On the 1881 census it appears neither of them have been born Leopold should have been on there at least but there is Karl (Charles) aged 6 months. The parents Phillip and Louisa seem to be the same people but their daughter Louisa is not the same one from the 1881 as is on the 1891. She is 2 in 1881 and 7 in 1891 (must be a later child with the same name?)

            Is it possible Leopold was originally know as Karl?

            Anne

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            • #7
              Well I am led to believe that Louise Gerlach was born in 1878 in England, but at this stage only have this second hand!

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Anne in Carlisle View Post
                Just been looking at the censuses. I presume you mean the 1891 census where Otto and Leopold are 10 and 11?


                Is it possible Leopold was originally know as Karl?

                Anne
                Then it would have been easier for him to produce a birth certificate in the name of Karl instead of Otto's when he changed his name????? I think there are some skeletons ready to come out, for whatever reason

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                • #9
                  i meant maybe look in germany for births of children of this couple?

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by hattie View Post
                    Well I am led to believe that Louise Gerlach was born in 1878 in England, but at this stage only have this second hand!
                    There is a Louise Margaret Gerlach born in Shoreditch in 1878 Vol 1C Page 83.

                    Now Shoreditch is only south up the Kingsland Road from Dalston.

                    Is this the birth you were thinking of?

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                    • #11
                      Originally posted by maggie_4_7 View Post
                      There is a Louise Margaret Gerlach born in Shoreditch in 1878 Vol 1C Page 83.

                      Now Shoreditch is only south up the Kingsland Road from Dalston.

                      Is this the birth you were thinking of?
                      Thats the one. Well if Philipp and Louise were married in Dalston in 1877, daughter Louise was born in 1878 in Dalston, Otto was born in Hoxton New Town in 1879 where is Leopold? I really think he must have been illigitimate and maybe came over from Germany with them, but wouldn't he have needed id docs for him?

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                      • #12
                        there are quite a few gerlach's born in london. none before the 1850's though, and never condensed.

                        but it does look like a name ripe for mistranscription.

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                        • #13
                          I've just noticed in the 1881 census it says see Schedule 36 just above their names so don't know what that refers to?

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                          • #14
                            Hattie - if Otto was born in 1879 (as per his certificate) he should be on the 1881 census. Have I got the wrong family? I have:
                            1881 Shoreditch
                            Philip Gerlach, 30, harnessmaker, born Germany
                            Louisa Gerlach, 29
                            Louisa, 2
                            Karl, 6 months

                            Where is Otto??

                            There is an Otto (surname unknown) aged 2 in Edmonton
                            RG11; Piece: 1390; Folio: 111; Page: 36; He's over the page living with a policeman and his wife. He's described as a 'boarder'

                            How about the theory that Otto and Leopold were adopted by Philip and Louisa? Clutching at straws here

                            Anne
                            Last edited by Anne in Carlisle; 29-03-09, 16:46.

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                            • #15
                              I think the 'see schedule 36' is to do with a mix up by the enumerator.

                              The Gerlachs are schedule 36, but 35 and 37 are blank. It looks as if all those pople on schedule 36 lived in the same building. There are a lot of boarders and their status may have been a bit vague as to whether or not they were in separate households.

                              Anne

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                              • #16
                                Originally posted by Anne in Carlisle View Post
                                Hattie - if Otto was born in 1879 (as per his certificate) he should be on the 1881 census. Have I got the wrong family? I have:
                                1881 Shoreditch
                                Philip Gerlach, 30, harnessmaker, born Germany
                                Louisa Gerlach, 29
                                Louisa, 2
                                Karl, 6 months

                                Where is Otto??

                                There is an Otto (surname unknown) aged 2 in Edmonton
                                RG11; Piece: 1390; Folio: 111; Page: 36; He's over the page living with a policeman and his wife. He's described as a 'boarder'

                                How about the theory that Otto and Leopold were adopted by Philip and Louisa? Clutching at straws here

                                Anne
                                Anne
                                I have a certified copy of Otto's birth certificate in front of me. It definitely says Registration District Shoreditch in Hoxton New Town, Middlesex.
                                Born 25 August 1879, Name Otto, Father's name Phillipp Gerlach, Mother's name Louise Gerlach formerly Gerlach. Occupation of father Harness Maker of 115 East Road, Hoxton New Town.

                                This is the very certificate which Leopold used to change his name and has legal declarations etc on it which correspond with the deed poll!


                                I think I'll adopt some Smiths as ancestors to make things easier

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                                • #17
                                  that smith comment is not funny, it's worse than the german's!!
                                  maybe otto died young? no wait you said he died in the 30's.

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                                  • #18
                                    Well - I don't know what to think, Hattie. It is the same address as the 1881census so where is Otto?????

                                    Is it possible he was staying with that family in Edmonton?

                                    Sorry - I've been no help at all :(

                                    Anne

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                                    • #19
                                      I wonder whether they were subject to the equavalent of Social Services? I don't really want to go into too much detail, but certainly Leopold wasn't the nicest of characters, especially to his children. The fact Leopold had to rely on his brother's identity is so bizarre.

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                                      • #20
                                        I take it you know they're on this one RG12; Piece: 119; Folio 173; Page 66 in St Pancras in 1891 and you're only looking for Otto and Leopold in 1881 aren't you?

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