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1911 census has really thrown the cat amongst the pigeons

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  • 1911 census has really thrown the cat amongst the pigeons

    OH's grandad would never tell his family anything about himself of his parents etc.
    He just said he wasn't wanted and that was all he would say.
    As you can imagine doing this side of the tree was difficult.

    Over 20 years ago we started this. Got his marriage cert.

    Peter Harrison and Lily Cox married Ashby de la Zouch on 25 Dec 1908.
    He was 23 years old and his fathers name was given as Thomas Harrison (deceased) The witnesses were members of the brides family.

    We knew he joined the Kings Own Yorkshire Light Infantry before he met Lily and then was called up as a reservist in WW1.

    The GRO searched for his birth cert for us. Peter Harrison, father Thomas born Yorkshire about 1885.
    We received one for a man born in Jun 1886 in York, father Thomas.

    NOW the problem. We have followed this line for years. Now with the 1911 York census release I find that this Peter Harrison is still in York and married to a Florence. I have to now rule this line out. All those certs are wrong!!

    MY Peter Harrison is in Ashby and married to Lily. His place of birth is listed as Rotherham, Yorkshire.

    I cannot find a birth to fit in Rotherham at the 1885 + or - a couple of years.

    And to confuse things, his pension record said he Joined in 1903 at the age of 18 and was born in Ashby :(

    HELPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPPP

  • #2
    oh poor you how frustrating , wish I could help not as clever as some on here though but will have a go.

    Comment


    • #3
      Name: Peter Harrison
      Birth: Dec 1880 - Rotherham, Derbyshire, South Yorkshire, Yorkshire - West Riding

      a few years out but could he have lied ???

      Comment


      • #4
        Forgot to say:

        One of his daughters had his birthday listed as 22 Jul in her diary. No year though of course.
        This other Peter in York was born on 11 Jun 1886.

        The 1911 census in Ashby gives his age as 25 although it isn't clear, there are 2 different couloured inks on the first number. I wondered if it were a 3 instead of a 2. The 5 is a definite.

        If he were 35 not 25, then why lie about your age in 1903 when joing the army? Why say you were 18 if you were 10 years older. Doesn't make sense.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Val wish Id never started View Post
          Name: Peter Harrison
          Birth: Dec 1880 - Rotherham, Derbyshire, South Yorkshire, Yorkshire - West Riding

          a few years out but could he have lied ???
          Yes, I've seen that Val, see my post above as well about his age in 1911.

          I have tried following that man up but got lost.

          Father in law is due here soon and I don't want to say anything to him as yet in case there is some funny business going on. It's his dad.

          Comment


          • #6
            What was Thomas' occupation?
            Oh, n/m it probably wasn't listed
            Tracy

            Comment


            • #7
              There are only 6 Peters born in Rotherham in 1885 - 1887.

              It would be worth trying to follow each one through, to see if they were part of a family and can be found on the next three censuses (or died young)

              What your Peter says about his personal circumstances makes it sound as if he might have been illegitimate and left home as soon as he could. He may have borne his stepfather's surname.

              It must be a huge blow, particularly to your OH, to discover the family you have been tracing is the wrong one.
              Phoenix - with charred feathers
              Researching Skillings from Norfolk, Sworn from Salisbury and Adams in Malborough, Devon.

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              • #8
                Originally posted by Orangeblossom View Post
                What was Thomas' occupation?
                Oh, n/m it probably wasn't listed
                Just said deceased on the death cert.

                Comment


                • #9
                  This is the 1911 with him on.

                  If someone can magnify the age you will see what I mean about it being altered perhaps.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    He doesn't want to be found, does he?

                    Could he have been in an Industrial School or a workhouse in 1901?
                    Phoenix - with charred feathers
                    Researching Skillings from Norfolk, Sworn from Salisbury and Adams in Malborough, Devon.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Hi, it is possible that he was born in one place and registed in another if that is where he was living when his mother or father got around to registering his birth. This was the case with my grandfather - he was born Leeds and registed in Rotherham.

                      Sandra

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sherbertrose View Post
                        Hi, it is possible that he was born in one place and registed in another if that is where he was living when his mother or father got around to registering his birth. This was the case with my grandfather - he was born Leeds and registed in Rotherham.

                        Sandra
                        But unless the person doing the registering told a porkie about the birthplace then wherever a birth was registered the entry in the GRO indexes should be for the correct registration district.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          There were two Peter Harrison born in the Rotherham district. One in 1878 and the other in 1880.

                          A bit too old to be mine but I'm grasping at straws.

                          I have tracked both of these through all census including 1911. So, not mine.

                          There was another birth in Hemsworth, not far from Rotherham in 1888 but that child died in 1888.

                          Help, I am well and truly in the mire.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            One result for 1911 census - the mother gave the wrong place of birth for her son :(:( - you'd think she'd have known where he was born!!



                            Researching Irish families: FARMER, McBRIDE McQUADE, McQUAID, KIRK, SANDS/SANAHAN (Cork), BARR,

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Maybe he was illegitimate and/or abandoned. If so, maybe he wasn't registered at all and took the name of a worker or inmate in the workhouse or wherever abandoned babies were put.

                              Just a thought.
                              My avatar is my Great Grandmother Emma Gumbert

                              Sue at Langley Vale

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                There's this one in St George, Walmgate, York in 1891 aged 5. Not sure if it tallies with the other Peter.
                                Class: RG12; Piece: 3893; Folio 15; Page 23

                                I can't get any images up at the moment for some reason.

                                Head, Father Thomas (41), mother Annie (29) , sister Mary E (6) and Thomas & Ellen Holmes, father & mother in law to Thomas.
                                Last edited by LangleyValeSue; 17-03-09, 21:11. Reason: Adding a bit!
                                My avatar is my Great Grandmother Emma Gumbert

                                Sue at Langley Vale

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by LangleyValeSue View Post
                                  There's this one in St George, Walmgate, York in 1891 aged 5. Not sure if it tallies with the other Peter.
                                  Class: RG12; Piece: 3893; Folio 15; Page 23

                                  I can't get any images up at the moment for some reason.

                                  Head, Father Thomas (41), mother Annie (29) , sister Mary E (6) and Thomas & Ellen Holmes, father & mother in law to Thomas.
                                  Hi Sue

                                  Yes, that's one I have been assuming it was for 20 years. Trouble is, he is still in the Walmgate area in 1911 when my Peter Harrison was in Ashby de la Zouch.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by LangleyValeSue View Post
                                    Maybe he was illegitimate and/or abandoned. If so, maybe he wasn't registered at all and took the name of a worker or inmate in the workhouse or wherever abandoned babies were put.

                                    Just a thought.
                                    Never even gave that one a thought. :(

                                    Oh heck, it's OH's paternal line.

                                    Keeps asking me if I have sorted it yet.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Margaret in Burton View Post
                                      Oh heck, it's OH's paternal line.
                                      Keeps asking me if I have sorted it yet.
                                      Ask him for some funds for certificates! :D:D

                                      And be grateful that he's interested.:D
                                      Uncle John - Passed away March 2020

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Originally posted by Uncle John View Post
                                        Ask him for some funds for certificates! :D:D

                                        And be grateful that he's interested.:D
                                        Oh he's interested. He did all the legwork going round records offices and churchyards when I couldn't when the children were small.

                                        He is prepared for certs. Even agreed straight away this morning to credits for the 1911 when I saw that York had been added.

                                        That's the problem, we thought we DID have the certs.

                                        Because because I can't find Peter's birth now, I can't get his birth cert. I have his marriage cert and death cert. I have his army pension record.

                                        Don't know where to go from here.

                                        Maybe what he meant by "I wasn't wanted" meant just that. He was abandoned.
                                        He wouldn't even divulge anything when he was dying, apparently just said "you don't need to know".

                                        Anyone know anything about childrens homes or workhouses in the Rotherham area?

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