Unconfigured Ad Widget

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Registering Births ...

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Registering Births ...

    I'm still trying to find 5 of my gt grandmother's babies ....

    I've drawn up a timeline of dates and addresses and have found a burial in 1887 of a stillborn baby whose location and mother match ... the child doesn't appear to have been given a name .......

    Were STBN births registered in 1887?
    Don't put off until tomorrow what you can do today ~ follow your dream!

  • #2
    It says in our Wiki that registration only started in 1927

    Stillbirth - Family Tree Forum

    I think some burials of Stillbirths were recorded in Parish registers. Depended on the vicar's views I think.

    Anne

    Comment


    • #3
      Thanks for your guidance Anne ... just poping over to the Wiki to read info
      Don't put off until tomorrow what you can do today ~ follow your dream!

      Comment


      • #4
        There are many mistakes in the Wiki.
        Yes stillbirths were often and still are often listed in parish registers.
        I have mentioned and given examples of this on many forums.
        examples-
        Entries of still-births do appear in parish registers
        Parish Register, Buildwas, Shropshire, 1696
        30 Sep. Sara, d. of Peter & Sarah Wolly, born Sep. 9th .. .. .. bap.
        The other was still-borne & bur. Sep. 9th.

        Parish Register, Alberbury, Shropshire, 1657
        Oct. 17. An infant, still-borne, of John Cottrell, on Onslow's Heath .. borne
        The said infant buried the same day.

        Parish Register, St Chad's, Shrewsbury, Shropshire, 1629
        Mar. 13. A still-borne Child of Roger Ammblar ... b.
        1633.
        Feb. 28. A still Borne Chilld of Hugh Nevetes ... b.
        1634
        July 23. A Stll Bourne Child of Thomas Ghough b.
        1635.
        Oct. 30. A Still Bourn Child of Greffrey Griffis... b.
        1648.
        June 29. A still-borne child of Thos. Meredith, bruar, in Frankwell ... ... bur.
        1655.
        Dec. 8. A still-borne child of Thomas Meridith bur.
        1644.
        Dec. 7. A still borne child of Mr. Robert Clarke & Marie … … … bur.
        1666.
        Oct 26. A stillborne child of Mr. Richard Gravenor, baker … … bur.
        1666.
        Nov. 30. A still borne child of Tymothy Dowling bur.
        Dec. 5. A still borne childe of Georg Gawen … bur.
        Jan. 6. A still borne child of Richard Wall, baker … … … bur.
        Mar. 7. A still borne childe of Edward Vicars … … … bur.
        1667.
        Sep. 6. A still-borne childe of Robert Oakley, shoemaker … … … bur.

        Whitkirk Burial Register
        1668
        April 13. A child of Thomas Dawsons, who was still-borne
        June 1. The wife of Thomas Harison and a Still-borne Childe.
        Octber 9. A still-borne child of willm Healds, sen.
        October 15. Another still-borne child of Thomas Capes
        February 27. A Still-borne Child of Robert Knipes.
        similar entries through to the last year I have access to in this register 1683
        March 6. A still-borne child of Hen. Thopson’s

        More are shown in an example on the front page of the Anguline site.

        Anyone in the world may apply for a search to be made in the still-birth register and may be supplied with a certificate.
        The decision for those other than siblings or parents is made on a case by case basis by the Registrar General.
        Cheers
        Guy
        Guy passed away October 2022

        Comment


        • #5
          Entries of still-births do appear in parish registers
          Yes, I'm sure they do Guy, but just because they sometimes do, doesn't mean they always do.

          I have not looked at anything like as many PRs as you have, I'm sure, but I have not seen any reference to still born children in the vast majority of PRs I have examined, so I wouldn't say the information in the wiki is wrong, just that maybe it should also say that records like those you have posted do exist.

          You are more than welcome to make whatever alterations to the wiki you see fit, of course.

          Comment


          • #6
            I would agree with Merry, Guy. I do have a lot of experience looking at parish records in Bedfordshire, Lincolnshire and Yorkshire. I have occasionally seen references to stillbirth burials. I have not listed any but it was my impression that they are mostly recorded in the earlier times before the introduction of the forms for recording the burials. Also I only saw them in some records - not all of them - hence my presumption that it was how the local vicar felt about it. I have not seen any recent entries for them.

            What is your evidence for saying there are MANY mistakes in the Wiki about this subject? If it is so full of errors you can, as Merry says, correct it yourself.

            Anne

            Comment


            • #7
              I have seen some stillbirths recorded in church registers - mostly as "abortive infant" and mostly very early, that is, pre 1700s. (Parish Registers of St Mary the Virgin, Blackburn - now Blackburn Cathedral)

              I doubt if Leicestershire Lass' great grandmother was around in the 1600s and 1700s, and in fact she was asking about stillbirths in the late 1800s! As far as I am aware, there was no civil REGISTRATION of stillbirths until 1927.

              OC

              Comment


              • #8
                Originally posted by Anne in Carlisle View Post
                I would agree with Merry, Guy. I do have a lot of experience looking at parish records in Bedfordshire, Lincolnshire and Yorkshire. I have occasionally seen references to stillbirth burials. I have not listed any but it was my impression that they are mostly recorded in the earlier times before the introduction of the forms for recording the burials. Also I only saw them in some records - not all of them - hence my presumption that it was how the local vicar felt about it. I have not seen any recent entries for them.

                What is your evidence for saying there are MANY mistakes in the Wiki about this subject? If it is so full of errors you can, as Merry says, correct it yourself.

                Anne
                I could very easily correct the wiki but I do not agree with the principles of wikis.
                They (and I am talking about wikis generally not about this forums wiki) purport to be knowledge bases but unfortunately they all contain errors and mistakes.
                This is due to the fact that they are open to change by anyone.
                Take possibly the most well known and oft quoted Wikepedia it suffers from exactly the same disadvantages that anyone may edit an article and therefore the accuracy is reduced to the lowest common denominator.
                As a result wikis cannot be relied on as accurate sources of information.

                As for not seeing recent entries of stillbirths in registers when I complied my Staincross , Yorkshire burials pages the register contained many stillbirths. For example take a look at
                stjscd3

                As I wrote they often appear, I did not write they are always noted in parish registers but “stillbirths were often and still are often listed in parish registers.”

                The reason they were recorded is they were required to be recorded by the various Acts of Parliament throughout history.
                Even Thomas Cromwell’s initial order required –
                “Item that yow and eny (every) pson (parson) vicare or curate this dioc (diocese) shall for euery churche kepe one boke or reistre wherin ye shall write the day and yere of every weddyng christenyng and buryeng made wtin (within) yor pishe for yowr tyme, and so euy man succedyng yow lykewise.”

                This means every burial whether the burial was for a person who had lived and died or whether the infant was stillborn.

                The 70th Canon of 1603 requires-
                “And henceforth upon every Sabbath Day immediately after Morning or Evening Prayer the Minister and Churchwardens shall take the said Parchment Book out of the said Coffer, and the Minister in the presence of the Churchwardens shall write and record in the said Book the names of all persons christened together with the names and surnames of their parents, and also the names of all Persons married and buried in that Parish, in the week before, and the day and year of every such Christening, Marriage and Burial.”
                The 1695 Act requires “For, and upon the Burial of every Person the Sum of four Shillings ;”

                However people being people meant that some couldn’t be bothered to comply with the regulations and did not bother to register stillbirths, others did.
                A similar situation occurred with burials in wool, many such burials were not recorded in later years even though the law remained in place.
                Cheers
                Guy
                Last edited by Guy; 10-03-09, 07:52.
                Guy passed away October 2022

                Comment


                • #9
                  I could very easily correct the wiki but I do not agree with the principles of wikis.
                  They (and I am talking about wikis generally not about this forums wiki) purport to be knowledge bases but unfortunately they all contain errors and mistakes.
                  This is due to the fact that they are open to change by anyone.
                  Every knowledge base has errors. Books, original documents, TV shows, the internet etc etc.

                  We all have to interpret the information we find and decide on it's accuracy for ourselves, often based on other information we have found previously.

                  We also have to interpret the information given to us by others and decide on it's accuracy.
                  Last edited by Merry Monty Montgomery; 10-03-09, 08:21.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Sorry, Guy. I have read the Acts of Parliament you quote through several times but failed to find any reference to stillbirths.

                    I have read with interest your register for Staincross and been very surprised. Good for them, I say. As I (and OC) said before our experience is that they are uncommon and those we have seen are all from much earlier times.

                    Until such time in the dim and distant future (ha ha!) when all Parish registers are transcribed I suppose none of us can say how widespread or frequent the custom was.

                    Anne

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Anne in Carlisle View Post
                      Sorry, Guy. I have read the Acts of Parliament you quote through several times but failed to find any reference to stillbirths.

                      I have read with interest your register for Staincross and been very surprised. Good for them, I say. As I (and OC) said before our experience is that they are uncommon and those we have seen are all from much earlier times.

                      Until such time in the dim and distant future (ha ha!) when all Parish registers are transcribed I suppose none of us can say how widespread or frequent the custom was.

                      Anne
                      I posted the relevant sections in my previous posting.
                      When an Act or an Order says every burial it means all burials without exception. That includes still-births.
                      Cheers
                      Guy
                      Guy passed away October 2022

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        hi everyone - just to clarify the burial was in 1887 in a public cemetery (not church) the entry merely states;

                        Surname, STBN, date of burial, plot number and mother's name

                        What's the likelihood baby was buried 2 days after being born?
                        Don't put off until tomorrow what you can do today ~ follow your dream!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          LL

                          Fairly likely, I would say. My ex's first wife gave birth to twins at home and one was stillborn. The stillborn was buried the same day (without any ceremony) in the local churchyard.

                          This was in the 1960s, by the way!

                          OC

                          Comment

                          Working...
                          X