Certificate fees......

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

I generally buy certificates from the GRO, but recently have had call to get a couple of births via Exeter and Newcastle upon Tyne register offices.

Exeter wanted £20 if I wanted the cert "quickly" - aparently meaning within four weeks!!! Their website says £20 is for a same day posing service! If I didn't mind waiting longer I could have the cert for £7.50. I said I would wait and got away with paying £7 possible because I always include a SAE. The cert arrived after nearly five weeks.

re Newcastle: I have just received my £7 cheque back (I posted it just five days ago), as the cert I was asking about had the wrong mum's name. They also pointed out that a copy cert from them has been £8 for nearly a year.

I would have thought by now all these services would have standard costs across the country.

What do others think?

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Oh, and Newcastle say they also charge £3 on top of the £8 for the copy cert if they have to do any sort of search for it, so I should have paid that as they would have had to search a full Q for the birth I was after. I should have sent them two chqs - one for £8 and one for £3. They've not actually asked for the £3 specifically, so I might not send it......shall see how I feel!

[maggie_4_7]

I would think that their justification for different costs are because of the different council costs.

i.e. different councils have different council tax costs bearing in mind the amount it takes to run council offices and services within that borough.

Its the only thing I can think of - but I expect they can charge what they like for invidiual bourough services without accountability.

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Yes, I'm sure that's the reason Maggie.

I can see I'm going to have to check each one (finding the fees for Exeter took me about 10 mins!!) before sending any money.

The last time I sent cheques to local offices on a regular basis was about 15 years ago so I've obviously lost touch - they were all £6.50 then, with no variations!

[maggie_4_7]

I must admit I don't have any faith in any council authorities or their services unless I'm face to face with someone.

Its not the individuals fault in most circumstances its just the endless red tape, forms and beaurocrasy that people hide behind to dodge issues.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Merry

The certificate itself still costs £7. The handling charges vary though, I've noticed - some charge £1, some 50p, some £2, etc. Some (most) won't take credit cards, some demand an sae. Most of them do charge £3 for a search, (as does the GRO) but if you don't send the £3 they won't be taking you to court!

I have noticed that local ROs have toughened up over the last few years about what they are prepared to do for free, but I still prefer the local to the GRO for a lot of reasons.

Incidentally, GRO charge £8.50 for a cert, if you do not use the automated service.

OC

[holcan]

Merry

The certificate itself still costs £7. The handling charges vary though, I've noticed - some charge £1, some 50p, some £2, etc. Some (most) won't take credit cards, some demand an sae. Most of them do charge £3 for a search, (as does the GRO) but if you don't send the £3 they won't be taking you to court!

I have noticed that local ROs have toughened up over the last few years about what they are prepared to do for free, but I still prefer the local to the GRO for a lot of reasons.

Incidentally, GRO charge £8.50 for a cert, if you do not use the automated service.

OC

I have in the past always obtained my certs from the GRO.
What is the advantage of obtaining them locally-as they seem very slow from every bodys experiences

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Mainly that you are one step nearer the actual event (all certs at the GRO are copies made within three months of the registration of the event), so one step less for errors to occur.

Secondly any signatures on the certs from local offices should be the actual sig rather than just a copy, so if it's important you see the signature of your ancestor/relative (maybe for comparison to another one) then it's vital you get the cert from a local office.

The main problem (other than discovering the cost!) is that not all local offices have a great indexing system, so if all you know is that X married April - June 1860 but you don't know the date or the church then a lot of reg offices won't look for you because that might mean looking through dozens of registers as each C of E church would have a different register plus the register completed by the registrar at dissenting churches and for register office weddings.

For births and death they are generally more accomodating as there's usually only a small number of sub-districts they need to look at.

London register offices often won't do family history requests at all, because they are too busy!

[borobabs]

Thank god Middlesbrough Stockton Redcar Guisborough Whitby Scarborough all chanrge the basic £7, and Tees Valley indexes cover quite few areas to search yourself , even Harrogate who hold Whitbys were very good and did a search for 1 cert for me and only charged the £7-00 ;;;good on the North East for change ;;

[maggie_4_7]

Yeah you can't blame them they're not geared up for it and to be honest it is a lot of work.

The fact that they even try to offer the service is a bonus I suppose.

It's probably better to go do a physical search yourself if you can although I can see it's impossible for a lot of people.

[modem]

I usually use the GRO but where, say, there are two or more possibilties for the same name in the same district and no age given I use the local office. You can give more vague checking details eg aproximate expected age or in the case of widows likely occupation(s) of husband etc.

Maybe I've been lucky but every local office I have used ie Ashford, Rugby, Newcastle under Lyme and Preston, has sent them return of post. I have heard that other offices are not so helpful. Also on at least two occasions I have been phoned to discuss whether the record they have found is likely to be the one I am looking for. The charges were £7 plus SAE.

If I am ordering more than one certificate I send a separate cheque for each one. It makes refunds for unsucessful applications easier, they just return the cheque.

[maggie_4_7]

London register offices often won't do family history requests at all, because they are too busy!

Well we have the LMA its all there.

So its a good day out. I have arrived at 9 and suddenly realise its 5pm before I know it.



Haven't been there for about 9 months but when I do I'll post a thread for lookups but they have to be specific. Because I have a lot for myself. I was hoping it would be online soon at Ancestry.

[Richard]

According to Ancestrys magazine the first lot of London records from LMA are coming online this spring, so pretty soon now. Can't wait!

[Smiley Sammy]

Gloucester will not oblige while you wait any more, not even for a recent event non-family history.
I live here but none of my ancestors are from here, I have requested certs for others though and in my experience you can see by their faces that they are totaly irritated at having to do Family history certs.
They have not been photcopies but hand written, I prefer photo copies fron the GRO, I like to decipher the hand writing myself and not have someone elses interpretation.
All that said, I love this hobby and I except the small probs that occur from time to time.
Sam

[Olde Crone Holden]

I always ASK, in my most charmingly oily manner, if I might have a photocopy rather than a handwritten copy.

I have only been refused twice, both times because the register was too fragile to open flat to photocopy, and the accommodating registrar traced the sigs for me!

However, I am very aware that staffing at most local Register Offices has been pared down to the bone - my local one is only open by appointment now and we have only one peripatetic registrar in the district, who does everything. Hope she is never ill.

OC

[Uncle John]

South Glos. were most apologetic that they couldn't do a copy because they didn't have a machine. I can't remember how much my Newcastle one was (ordered using a print of the online form) but I would have remembered if it was more than £7.

[Guy]

Yeah you can't blame them they're not geared up for it and to be honest it is a lot of work.

The fact that they even try to offer the service is a bonus I suppose.

It's probably better to go do a physical search yourself if you can although I can see it's impossible for a lot of people.

Yes you can blame them!

That is one of the core reasons for their existence.
The 1936 Act states it this way-
"XXXV. And be it enacted, That every Rector, Vicar, or Curate, and every Registrar, Registering Officer, and Secretary, who shall have the keeping for the Time being of any Register Book of Births, Deaths, or Marriages, shall at all reasonable Times allow Searches to be made of any Register Book in his keeping, and shall give a Copy certified under his Hand of any Entry or Entries in the same, on Payment of the Fee herein-after mentioned ; (that is to say,) for every Search extending over a Period not more than One Year the Sum of One Shilling, and Sixpence additional for every additional Year, and the Sum of Two Shillings and Sixpence for every single Certificate.

XXXVI. And be it enacted, That every Superintendent Registrar shall cause Indexes of the Register Books in his Office to be made, and kept with the other Records of his Office ; and that every Person shall be entitled at all reasonable Hours to search the said Indexes, and to have a certified Copy of any Entry or Entries in the said Register Books under the Hand of the Superintendent Registrar, on Payment of the Fees herein-after mentioned ; (that is to say,) for every general Search the Sum of Five Shillings, and for every particular Search the Sum of One Shilling, and for every such certified Copy the Sum of Two Shillings and Sixpence."

If the Registrars or Superintendent Registrars cannot be bothered to fulfill their duties they should be sacked and replaced with those who will carry out the duties required by law.
Cheers
Guy

[Little Nell]

If only it cost 5 shillings!

Personally I;m amazed there isn;t a standard turnaround time and search fees throughout the country. The government have slipped up there, they need to introduce targets asap!

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

If the Registrars or Superintendent Registrars cannot be bothered to fulfill their duties they should be sacked and replaced with those who will carry out the duties required by law

Surely the local councils should have a duty to employ sufficient people, properly trained, in order to uphold the law? Sacking the people who do the job wouldn't help one iota!

[maggie_4_7]

Yes you can blame them!

That is one of the core reasons for their existence.
The 1936 Act states it this way-
"XXXV. And be it enacted, That every Rector, Vicar, or Curate, and every Registrar, Registering Officer, and Secretary, who shall have the keeping for the Time being of any Register Book of Births, Deaths, or Marriages, shall at all reasonable Times allow Searches to be made of any Register Book in his keeping, and shall give a Copy certified under his Hand of any Entry or Entries in the same, on Payment of the Fee herein-after mentioned ; (that is to say,) for every Search extending over a Period not more than One Year the Sum of One Shilling, and Sixpence additional for every additional Year, and the Sum of Two Shillings and Sixpence for every single Certificate.

XXXVI. And be it enacted, That every Superintendent Registrar shall cause Indexes of the Register Books in his Office to be made, and kept with the other Records of his Office ; and that every Person shall be entitled at all reasonable Hours to search the said Indexes, and to have a certified Copy of any Entry or Entries in the said Register Books under the Hand of the Superintendent Registrar, on Payment of the Fees herein-after mentioned ; (that is to say,) for every general Search the Sum of Five Shillings, and for every particular Search the Sum of One Shilling, and for every such certified Copy the Sum of Two Shillings and Sixpence."

If the Registrars or Superintendent Registrars cannot be bothered to fulfill their duties they should be sacked and replaced with those who will carry out the duties required by law.
Cheers
Guy

Well perhaps someone should let them know about The 1936 Act and what their job is then because some of them quite clearly aren't aware of it.