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  • Two wives called Ann

    I wonder if someone can help me please
    My gtr gt grandfather James Rapley married Ann Borne in 1860 Newick, Sussex and had a daughter Fanny (b 8-5-1860 Newick Sussex) and they appear together on the 1861 census in Newick.
    In 1871 James and his wife Ann appear with their children Fanny, William, Alice, Kate and George. However the birth certificates for Alice and Kate give the mother's name as Ann Rapley formerly Sargant.
    I haven't been able to find
    any birth reference for the William
    any death for Ann Rapley nee Borne
    any marriage for James to Ann Sargant

    Would be grateful for any ideas/suggestions
    thank you

  • #2
    Newdigate comes under Dorking, so possibly

    Births Mar 1860
    RAPLEY William
    Dorking 2a 122

    No, scrap that. Can't have been born before Fanny lol
    Tracy

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    • #3
      Looking at the two censuses, Ann has the same POB and DOB, which suggests she is the same person on both.

      Are you sure the 1860 marriage is right? Do you have the cert? Perhaps she was married before (briefly!)

      Edit: Had a look in 1851. There is an Ann Sargant, but no Ann Borne born c1841, Horley.
      Last edited by Orangeblossom; 06-02-09, 23:35.
      Tracy

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      • #4
        Tracy
        Yes, found that one, did also wonder if William was born to Ann Sargant before any marriage but the only birth in Surrey was William H Sargant and have found him in later census

        Comment


        • #5
          Tracy
          Oops sorry bit slow at this.
          Yes I have the marriage certificate for James Rapley and Ann Borne 21 Apr 1860 Newick Sussex.
          Until I got the later certificates I thought they were one and the same.

          Comment


          • #6
            What is the name of Ann's father on the cert?
            Tracy

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            • #7
              Ann's father was William Borne, Labourer and she gave her age as 19 and place of residence as Newick

              Comment


              • #8
                Maybe they changed their name?

                1851

                William Sargant - Farm Labourer - 37 Lingfield Surrey
                Caroline - 35 Horley Surrey
                Ann - 10 " "
                Alfred - 4 " "
                Jos. - 2 " "


                or maybe not...
                1861
                William Sargent 49 Lingfield
                Caroline Sargent 44 Horley
                James Sargent 12 "
                Ellen Sargent 9 "
                Jane Sargent 6 Charlwood
                Last edited by Orangeblossom; 06-02-09, 23:52.
                Tracy

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                • #9
                  'Maybe they changed their name?'
                  do you mean the Borne family changed their name to Sargant?
                  Have also been looking for the birth of Ann Borne but no result although I did find a birth for Ann Sargant 2nd qtr 1839 Reigate district which I have sent for - not sure where that will take me but seemed like a good idea.

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                  • #10
                    Do the witnesses on the Borne marriage cert give any clues?

                    Is there a full address for either party?
                    Jackie

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                    • #11
                      The witnesses to the marriage were James' sister and her husband - Charles and Fanny Smith. Unfortunately both James and Ann give their residence as just Newick.
                      Forgot to mention at beginning - birth certificate for Fanny, daughter of James and Ann, has mother's name as Ann Rapley formerly Bourne with an address of Birchland, Newick

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                      • #12
                        Yes - to Sargant or from Sargant.
                        It all seems too coincidental for them not to be the same person.
                        Tracy

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                        • #13
                          I think you may find that Ann b1839 is daughter of 'Stev' and Sarah.

                          Been trying to find William and Caroline in 1841, but came up with them instead lol
                          Tracy

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                          • #14
                            This might be relevant

                            Ann Sargent's parents were William and Caroline

                            There is a marriage for William Sargeant Q/E Sep 1841 Croydon and one of the other names listed is Caroline Bourne. It could be that Ann was born to Caroline before she married William. So her name at birth was Ann Bourne but she later took the name Sargeant. Sound possible?
                            Jackie

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Ok, here's a spanner....

                              William Bourne 40 Ag Lab
                              Elizabeth Bourne 35
                              Henry Bourne 11
                              William Bourne 8
                              James Bourne 6
                              Ann Bourne 4
                              Fanney Bourne 2

                              living Horley. All born in county



                              1851
                              William Bourn 53 Horley
                              Elizabeth Bourn 46 Horley
                              Henry Bourn 21 Charlwood
                              Ann Bourn 14 Charlwood
                              Fanny Bourn 12 Charlwood
                              Thomas Bourn 9 Charlwood
                              Peter Bourn 7 Charlwood
                              Mary Bourn 79 (Mother) NK
                              Richard Bourn 23 (Son - brother) Horley
                              Eliza Bourn 48 (Visitor)


                              on that note, I'm off to bed lol
                              Last edited by Orangeblossom; 07-02-09, 00:37.
                              Tracy

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Tracy and Jackie
                                Oh gosh, totally confused now.
                                The William Sargeant/Caroline Bourne sounded a possibility - although hadn't been able to find any birth registered. And then again the naming of the children of William and Elizabeth Bourne is very familiar...
                                Glad I ordered the Ann Sargant birth certificate now, that will at least give me her parents names.
                                Thank you both for your help

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                                • #17
                                  There is a Ann Bourne born 1842 Slaugham Sussex in 1851 HO107/1642/281/16 with father William, mother Elizabeth and a brother Charles. Slaugham is not too far from Newick, as the crow flies!
                                  Lesley passed away in November 2017.

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                                  • #18
                                    There is a marriage on IGI for William Sargeant and Caroline Bourne 8.8.1841 St John the Baptist Croydon
                                    Jackie

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                                    • #19
                                      Lesley, thank you, had a look and found birth registration for her so will get that certificate as well

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Jackie, thank you, will keep a note of that marriage for reference when I get the birth certificates.

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