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  • curious entry on birth certificate

    Hi All, i wonder if anyone else has seen an entry like this and could explain what it means?
    I have a copy of a birth certificate for 1841 and the informant is listed as father but there is a deliberate wide space between the first name and surname with an `X` here and above that in tiny writing is two words i cant make out, the first is 2 or 3 letters long and the second may be up to 8 letters long. anyone seen this before?
    Thanks,
    Griff

  • #2
    Is it possible for you to scan an image for us to see?
    Bridget

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    • #3
      Could it be "his mark"?
      Wendy



      PLEASE SCAN AT 300-600 DPI FOR RESTORATION PURPOSES. THANK YOU!

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      • #4
        I dont have a scanner, i will try to photograph it and post that.
        Griff

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        • #5
          It's probably "his mark" meaning that he put the X as he couldn't sign his own name.
          ~ with love from Little Nell~
          Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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          • #6
            Yes, sure to be - that's quite common.

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            • #7
              Heres a photo of the entry, i dont think its his mark as i think only the registrar entered the details, by the way can anyone make out the occupation, appears to be Rope ????maker.
              Griff.
              Attached Files

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              • #8
                Hi Griff

                It says "the mark of"


                :D

                Remembering: Cuthbert Gregory 1889 - 1916, George Arnold Connelly 1886 - 1917, Thomas Lowe Davenport 1890 - 1917, Roland Davenport Farmer 1885 - 1916, William Davenport Sheffield 1879 - 1915, Cuthbert Gregory 1918 - 1944

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                • #9
                  Thanks Tom, so it was actually practice in those days to sign the birth certificate?
                  Griff.

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                  • #10
                    Yep looks like "the mark of" to me, & "Rope Matmaker"


                    Joanie

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                    • #11
                      It still is the practice to sign birth certificates. It was always required that birth, marriage and death certificates would be signed, births and deaths by the informant, and marriages by the couple.
                      ~ with love from Little Nell~
                      Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                      • #12
                        Yes Griff, what happened was that the registrar had a book where the informant would sign it (or put an X if they could not write as is the case here).

                        Then what would happen is that the registrar would copy all his books out into the new books and then send them off to the GRO. Where it was signed by the informant he would just write their name. So the ones you get from the GRO are all in the registrar's writing.

                        However, the original ones which were signed by the informant are still at the local registry offices and some of those will scan the original books for you so that you get a copy of their signatures.

                        Hope this helps :D

                        Remembering: Cuthbert Gregory 1889 - 1916, George Arnold Connelly 1886 - 1917, Thomas Lowe Davenport 1890 - 1917, Roland Davenport Farmer 1885 - 1916, William Davenport Sheffield 1879 - 1915, Cuthbert Gregory 1918 - 1944

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                        • #13
                          Many thanks for the information, i cant manage to make the occupation out to be matmaker, anyone else with ideas?
                          I am know trying to find the marriage certificate for Thomas Griffin, who married Sophia Groves in 1831 according to Pallots index. What is this? it only shows the entry "Thomas Griffin = Sophia Groves 1831" the district is given as St. Leonards, Shoreditch.
                          the Official marriage index shows exactly half the number of entries as Pallots, and they are not on here, anyone any ideas?

                          Griff
                          Last edited by Griff; 02-11-08, 19:37.

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                          • #14
                            Might be "rope and sailmaker", very badly written.

                            The first letter doesn't look like the M in Mark, but it doesn't look much like the S in Street, either.

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                            • #15
                              Griff, could you find Thomas on any census to clarify his occupation?
                              Rose

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                              • #16
                                Rope mat making was a genuine occupation, it appears if you google it.

                                To me it looks like a "M" with a curl and then "at" followed by a curly "m" and "aker"


                                Joanie

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                                • #17
                                  Joan, apologies, you are right!!
                                  His occupation on the 1841 census is "matmaker"!!!
                                  Griff.

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                                  • #18
                                    Well done, Joan

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                                    • #19
                                      I am know trying to find the marriage certificate for Thomas Griffin, who married Sophia Groves in 1831 according to Pallots index. What is Pallots index? it only shows the entry "Thomas Griffin = Sophia Groves 1831" the district is given as St. Leonards, Shoreditch.
                                      the Official marriage index shows exactly half the number of entries as Pallots, and they are not on here, anyone any ideas?
                                      Griff.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Griff

                                        Pallot's index is exactly what it says, an index, made originally on slips of paper and mainly of London churches, though it does include other parishes.
                                        The official marriage index is the GRO one, which has marriages since civil registration began 1 July 1937.
                                        Pallot's is very good for finding marriages before that date.
                                        You will need to look at the original parish registers for St Leonards Shoreditch which are at the London Metropolitan Archives (but also, I think at the Guildhall library in London).

                                        Marriages before 1837 don't have as much information as those afterwards. It will have the names of the bride and groom and whether they were single or widowed, as well as if any of them were minors (under 21) and which parish they were living in at the time of the marriage as well as the names of the witnesses.
                                        ~ with love from Little Nell~
                                        Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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