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**Harrys mum** · 31-10-08, 01:47

Hi Val~~~~

Where did he come in Australia??

**Harrys mum** · 31-10-08, 01:55

Can't find much, but these are on AVRI

Marriages:

All Thomas Allsop

1882 Mary Clift Victoria
6-10-1894 Mary Keogh Tom age 42 Mary 45 Tasmania.

**Val and George** · 31-10-08, 02:01

Hi Libby, not sure where he was in Oz, but family lore has him as in Victoria, but that is purely guesswork I think.
I might seem a bit daft here but in the above, does that mean a Thomas Allsop married Mary Clift in Victoria in 1882

and on the 6-10-1894 a Mary Keogh married Thomas Allsop in Tasmania?
Val

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 02:10

The Samuel Plimsoll went to NSW, and it was full of Allsopps. Just trying to work out who's who.

**Harrys mum** · 31-10-08, 02:12

Yes Val......both of those are marriages to a Thomas Allsop.

There are quite afew Allsops but most before your fellow came.

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 02:16

The NSW State Records passenger list shows the following passengers arriving on the Samuel Plimsoll in 1876:

ALLSOPP Elizabeth / 8 / and family
ALLSOPP Frederick / 17 /
ALLSOPP James E / 27 / and wife
ALLSOPP Jessie / 4 / and family
ALLSOPP Mary A / 29 / and family
ALLSOPP Priscella / 24 / and husband
ALLSOPP Thomas / 32 / and family

State Archives Collection

http://www.records.nsw.gov.au/indexes/searchform.aspx

Making history every day

Marriages Jun 1874
Allsop James Samuel Barrow 7a 253
Boulton Catherine Barrow 7a 253
Boulton Priscilla Barrow 7a 253
Lowe Elizabeth Barrow 7a 253
Smith Henry Barrow 7a 253

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 02:18

Not sure if this is your man - Barrow on Soar's in Leicestershire. Did Thomas have any connection with that area?

**Val and George** · 31-10-08, 02:29

No Mary, he was born and lived in London and his Father was born in Essex.
Really not sure if he had a family when he came out here, had thought he hadn't, but not sure why I had thought that.
It turns out be quite a common name which makes things more difficult.

Thankyou Libby for those marriages, are the marriage certificates for australia much the same regards the information they show - as the UK ones?
Val

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 02:39

I would think the Thomas Allsopp who travelled on the Samuel Plimsoll was related to the others, as it says he's travelling with family - probably James' brother.

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 02:47

Australian certs are much better than English ones, apart from the very early ones.

**flashieboy** · 31-10-08, 03:28

I would think you can rule out the Tasmanian one.

Thomas Alsopp 1803 England...married 1868...ELiza Kirk.

These are their children.

1854 Thomas....married 1894....Mary Keogh in Deloraine Tasmania
1855 Eliza
1858 female
1860 MAry ann
1864 Emily

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 03:37

I can't fathom this lot out at all.

I was hoping to find Elizabeth Allsopp b. 1868 on the 1871 English census, but I can't find a likely candidate.

A Thomas Allsopp aged 22 travelled to Queensland in 1866 on the Legion of Honor with a Mary Allsopp aged 20.

And I've just found some of the family from the Samuel Plimsoll travelling to London from Victoria on the Somersetshire, departing in August 1875.

The family consists of Thomas Allsopp, 31, Mrs Allsopp (not named), 29, Elizabeth, 7, Jessie, 2, and Infant Allsopp.

Index to Outward Passengers to Interstate, UK, NZ and Foreign Ports 1852-1886

The Samuel Plimsoll arrived in Sydney in August 1876, and the journey took a couple of months, so they would have reached England on the Somersetshire around October 1875, and set off again about 6 months later. I wonder why?

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 03:50

There's a complete passenger list for the Samuel Plimsoll here, with the passengers sorted into some kind of order:

ALLSOP JAMES E. / MILLER / EMIGRANT
ALLSOP PRISCILLA / EMIGRANT
ALLSOP THOMAS / EMIGRANT
ALLSOP MARY ANN / EMIGRANT
ALLSOP CHILD 1 / EMIGRANT
ALLSOP CHILD 2 / EMIGRANT

http://mariners.records.nsw.gov.au/1876/08/071sam.htm

**Val and George** · 31-10-08, 04:00

From the above list Mary, would you take it that James and Priscilla are a couple and that Thomas and Mary Ann are another couple with two children?
Val

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 04:12

That's what it looks like, yes, although Mary isn't listed as a wife on the NSW version of the passenger list. I posted James and Priscilla's marriage upthread.

I've just been trying to work out a possible scenario.

This might be the marriage of Thomas and Mary (there are only 3 possibles between 1856, when Thomas would be barely old enough to marry, and 1866):

Marriages Jun 1865
Allsop Thomas Ashborne 7b 745
Hardy Joseph Ashborne 7b 745
Robinson Mary Ann Ashborne 7b 745
Worthy Ruth Ashborne 7b 745

(Ashborne's in Derbyshire, which is near Leicestershire.)

Thomas and Mary then emigrate to Queensland in 1866.
Elizabeth's born in 1868, Jessie in 1872, and infant in 1875.
They go back to England in 1875 (leaving James and Priscilla in Australia), infant dies, and they return to Australia the next year.

How they could afford to do that beats me - maybe Thomas was a crew member?

Anyway, this is just speculation. It doesn't rule him out 100%, but the other two possible marriages are both in the Midlands, so I doubt whether he's your man.

**Val and George** · 31-10-08, 04:18

Thanks Ruth, yes I can rule out the Tasmanian Thomas

I would like to find out more about the Thomas Allsop and Mary Clift marriage in Victoria.
Are there any census available for after their marriage date of 1882?
Val

Mary, I just caught your last message on page one, and I would imagine they travelled together as a family unit with Thomas and James being brothers.
So please disregard my previous post.

Val

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 04:20

From the NSW births index:

Registration Number / Last Name / Given Name(s) / Father's Given Name(s) / Mother's Given Name(s) / District

6710/1867 / ALLSOP / ELIZABETH S / THOMAS W / MARY A W / BINALONG
6723/1868 / ALLSOPP / MARY A / THOMAS / MARY A / BINALONG
7015/1870 / ALLSOPP / THOMAS WILLIAM / THOMAS WILLIAM / MARY ANN / BINALONG
8489/1873 / ALLSOPP / JESSIE / THOMAS / MARY ANN / BOOROWA
4117/1876 / ALLSOPP / THOMAS PLIMSOLL / THOMAS / MARY ANN / GLEBE
10319/1878 / ALLSOPP / FREDERICK / THOMAS / MARY A / BOOROWA
28889/1881 / ALLSOPP / OSWALD / THOMAS WILLIAM / MARY ANN / MURRUMBURRAH
32317/1883 / ALLSOPP / EDITH MURIEL / THOMAS WILLIAM / MARY ANN / MURRUMBURRAH
35027/1885 / ALLSOPP / ARTHUR / THOMAS / MARY A / MURRUMBURRAH
37189/1887 / ALLSOPP / HAROLD / THOMAS / MARY A / MURRUMBURRAH

I wonder if Thomas Plimsoll was born on board?

**Mary from Italy** · 31-10-08, 04:24

Originally posted by Val and George View Post

I would like to find out more about the Thomas Allsop and Mary Clift marriage in Victoria.
Are there any census available for after their marriage date of 1882?

There are no Australian censuses available apart from the 1841.

There are some oldish electoral rolls for Victoria, though - I'll have a look.

**Val and George** · 31-10-08, 04:25

Good grief Mary, you beat me to it again.!!
That scenario looks possible, but like you I wonder how they could have afforded it? And what a trip to take with two littlies in tow?
I'm not too sure what my Thomas would have been doing in Ashborne, although he may have met Mary closer to London and just headed back to her home town for the wedding.
The Thomas who married Mary Clift in Victoria is looking the better bet so far.
I'll see if I can find out if any other names were mentioned in the Christmas card. The person who has it lives in the UK, so will send him an email and hope to hear from him by the morning (our time).
Many thanks to everyone for the info you have dug up so far, much appreciated
Val

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