Where do I start?

[Muggins in Sussex]

I am trying to find the identity of someone who is refered to in the Manchester Guardian in 1940 as having served three years in prison during WW1 "because of his conscientious convictions".

That is all I know - I don't have a name for this person who may have been my grandfather.

Any ideas where I could start please?

[Kit]

Are there any other references other editions of the paper? If there is no name then I have no idea as there probably would have been lots of connscientious objectors at that time.

[tinkerbe]

hi

i am doing a goole search

and will post anything i think is interesting

::Conscientious Objectors::

[tinkerbe]

CONSCIENTIOUS OBJECTION PROJECT

[tinkerbe]

and there is a book
Waterstones.com: History and Transport: We Will Not Fight...: The Untold Story of World War One's Conscientious Objectors by Will Ellsworth-Jones (2008)

and what is in the book

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-514300/Brothers-war-The-WW1-soldier-pacifist--hero.html

[tinkerbe]

from what i have google

they had to go to tribunal (an interviewing panel with legal authority) so there might be records

maybe a look at

Manchester City Council - Manchester City Archives - About Manchester City Archives

and send a few emails

happy hunting

[tinkerbe]

sorry i have just re read and seen 1940 for some reason i got ww1

some links for ww2
CONSCIENTIOUS OBJECTION

BBC - WW2 People's War - Cadbury's Chocolate Soldiers! Memories of a Conscientious Objector

these pages have some ideas too
CONSCIENTIOUS OBJECTION PROJECT

.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Three years in prison was a very long time for a conscientious objector, I think. They were normally put into non combatant war work.

A three year sentence suggests the tribunal was not convinced his objections were religious or moral, or heart-felt, more that he was deliberately avoiding going to war.

I am assuming this ties in with your other threads and if so, yes, sounds like your man.

Tinkerbe

You were right first time - it was during WW1.

OC

[tinkerbe]

well in that case

she might be lucky here
The Working Class Movement Library’s holding of Manchester N-CF Branch’s records includes notes of appearances at the Manchester Tribunal in WW1.
Richmond Castle, Yorkshire, has names of many members of the WW1 NCC held there.

http://www.wcml.org.uk/

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

They were normally put into non combatant war work.

I think you might get a stiff sentence if you refused to do the non combatant war work.

[Olde Crone Holden]

Merry

Yes, that's what I meant. Three years prison would be for more than just refusing to fight. If you also refused to do war work that would be seen as more than (or do I mean less than?!) religious or moral principle.

OC

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Under what circumstances were you shot? (or was that only for desertion?)

[Olde Crone Holden]

I am not entirely sure - I would have said for desertion or running away from the enemy, but in the back of my mind is something telling me about COs who were shot in (civil) prison?

OC

[Mary from Italy]

I seem to remember reading that in WW1 some COs were somehow drafted into the military, and then shot when they refused to fight.

[Mary from Italy]

Joan, is there any particular reason you think this person is your grandfather? Was there no name at all in the Manc Guardian article?

[Mary from Italy]

In 1921 the Ministry of Health decided that all papers relating to individual exemption from National Service, including those on grounds of
conscientious objection, should be destroyed along with every tribunal minute book except those of the Central Tribunal.

All together some 16,000 conscientious objectors obtained exemption certificates through the Military Service Tribunals. Of these, 6,312 had been arrested, and 5,970 court-martialled (521 of them three times, 50 five times and three six times), 819 men had spent over two years in prison, much of that time on bread and water and in solitary confinement.

The majority of objectors took up non-combatant duties as medical orderlies, serving in the catering corps or working in labour camps run by the Home Office.

Those whose appeals were refused were ‘handed over to the military authorities’. Fifty of them were sent to fight in France thirty of whom were sentenced to be shot for refusing to accept military discipline. The sentences were commuted at the last moment after intensive lobbying led by the No-Conscription Fellowship.

https://www.le.ac.uk/lahs/downloads/05_7799_vol77_Elliott.pdf

[Muggins in Sussex]

Thanks all - I have loads to look at and think about now

Mary, I think he may have been my grandfather because the newspaper report (thanks, Jackie is about my father who was himself a conscientious objector in WW2 and the report refers to someone who was either the father of my father, or possibly the father of another CO (it is not clear from the report) as being the person who served the three years in prison during WW2.

Hope that makes sense - it seems a very long sentence :D

[Night Owl]

I've just seen a trailer for a Channel 4 programme next Monday (10th November at 8pm) about conscientious objectors in WW1. Presented by Ian Hislop "Not Forgotten: The Men Who Wouldn't Fight".

Looks like it might be interesting

Jackie

[Muggins in Sussex]

Ooh, thank you, Jackie

I will make sure I watch it

[Northern Light]

I've just seen a trailer for a Channel 4 programme next Monday (10th November at 8pm) about conscientious objectors in WW1. Presented by Ian Hislop "Not Forgotten: The Men Who Wouldn't Fight".

Looks like it might be interesting

Jackie

Thanks for that it should be very interesting..