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Halllows/Ingram puzzle

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  • Halllows/Ingram puzzle

    Thanks to Modem's thread about the BVRI being on Ancestry, I managed to find a christening for my elusive 3xgrt grandfather John Ingram Hallows.

    The christening took place in Tranmere, Cheshire in 1848. The transcription gives John's age as 9 and his date of birth as 24th July 1839. His parents are Joseph Hallows and Mary.

    This fits in with a possible family that I found on the 1851 census living in Tranmere. Joseph and Mary with son John aged 11. John's place of birth is given as Newtown, Mongomeryshire, which fits in with the information given on his Australian marriage certificate in 1863. However, it doesn't fit in with any other subsequent places of birth on his children's certificates or the census when he came back to England. These were, Liverpool and Stockton Quay, Cheshire but they're all not very far away from each other.

    Before finding this christening entry I had ordered 3 certificates for John Hallows born in the rightish area in the early 1840s but none of them were correct.

    I know, from the Australian certificates that Mary's maiden name was Ingram and yesterday I checked for any Ingram births in Sept quarter 1839 and bingo! I found one in the Newtown&Co district of Montgomeryshire. I think this is probably him, what do you think?

    I haven't been able to find a marriage for Joseph and Mary, although it could have taken place before 1837. I was wondering if John's late christening may have been a way for Joseph to say that he thought of John as his son even if this wasn't the case? Or am I getting carried away :D


  • #2
    Well, we are now in the realm of guessing, because we don't know.

    Have you looked for a John Ingram baptism? I've found that most illegitimate children were baptised in their first year just as legitimate children were.

    Or perhaps, having married Joseph, who may or may not have been John's father, they saw the baptism as conferring respectability and legitimacy on John. Have you checked to see if any other Hallows children were baptised on the same day? Perhaps Mary and Joseph had another baby and got John baptised at the same time just to be on the safe side.
    ~ with love from Little Nell~
    Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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    • #3
      Have you found the Ingrams & Hallows in 1841?
      ~ with love from Little Nell~
      Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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      • #4
        According to the BVRI no other Hallows children were baptised on that day.
        There doesn't seem to be a christening for John Ingram in the right dates but as I can only check the IGI this doesn't mean a great deal. FreeReg isn't working for me today.
        I haven't checked the full indexes for a Hallows/Ingram marriage in Tranmere, so I'll just go and do that.

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        • #5
          No, I haven't been able to find them together as a family or individually in 1841.

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          • #6
            When and where was Mary born?
            ~ with love from Little Nell~
            Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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            • #7
              Mary was born about 1814 but she's a bit vague about where she was born. In 1851 it says Llanymenn, Mongomeryshire, which I can't find. I haven't found her or Joseph in 1861 but from 1881 onwards she gives, Shrewsbury, Shropshire as her place of birth :o

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              • #8
                What is the 1851 census ref?
                Elaine







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                • #9
                  when did he die? his australian death cert would give a lot of info. but if he died in england....

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Georgette View Post

                    and yesterday I checked for any Ingram births in Sept quarter 1839 and bingo! I found one in the Newtown&Co district of Montgomeryshire. I think this is probably him, what do you think?

                    There is a John Ingram (age 3) on the 1841 census, with parents Ann and John living in Llanidloes, which is in the Newtown district.
                    HO107; Piece 1436; Book: 7; Civil Parish: Llanidloes; County: Montgomeryshire; Enumeration District: 5; Folio: 24; Page: 10; Line: 24;
                    I wonder if the birth registration you found could belong to him although if it does his age is not right on the census!
                    Elaine







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                    • #11
                      1851 is: HO170/2175/882/31

                      Here is Mary Hallows, John and two of his children in 1881 back from Australia: RG11/3723/32/7 - they've been mistranscribed as Harlow

                      Just popping out for a walk and will be back later - sorry :o
                      Last edited by Georgette; 31-08-08, 13:37.

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Elaine ..Spain View Post
                        There is a John Ingram (age 3) on the 1841 census, with parents Ann and John living in Llanidloes, which is in the Newtown district.
                        HO107; Piece 1436; Book: 7; Civil Parish: Llanidloes; County: Montgomeryshire; Enumeration District: 5; Folio: 24; Page: 10; Line: 24;
                        I wonder if the birth registration you found could belong to him although if it does his age is not right on the census!

                        I think that John corresponds to another certificate that I have for a John born in 1838 to John and Ann formerly Warmer.

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                        • #13
                          Originally posted by kylejustin View Post
                          when did he die? his australian death cert would give a lot of info. but if he died in england....
                          Unfortunately, he died in 1906 in England, Kyle :o

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                          • #14
                            Very inconsiderate of him!
                            ~ with love from Little Nell~
                            Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                            • #15
                              Ah, but he left a will, Nell! Which told me absolutely zilch :D

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