Shortened names

[margaretmarch]

Hi,
Can anyone help please?

I have just started looking at my father's ancestors from Belfast and have been told he had an uncle called 'Massie'. Any ideas what this could be short for? I found an aunt called 'Minnie' who turned out to be Mary Elizabeth.

Also any thoughts on where I can find BMD's for NI other than The Ulster Historical Foundation on AncestryIreland.com? I've had no luck finding the birth of my grandfather or any of his 5 siblings on this site.
Thanks, Margaret

[KiteRunner]

Margaret, if you can get to an LDS (Mormon) church Family History Centre then they may have the Irish GRO indexes on microfilm, but not sure if they will cover the years you are looking for as I don't know what they are! Otherwise you would have to go to Belfast to look them up at the GRONI, or get somebody to do it for you, or maybe you have enough information to order the certificates from GRONI without looking them up on the indexes?
GRO Web Site

If you can post up the names you're looking for (assuming the people are no longer alive) then we could have a try on the sites you mentioned just in case you missed something?

As for Massie, I can't think what it could be short for but not all nicknames are short for the person's name anyway.

[Uncle John]

As for Massie, I can't think what it could be short for but not all nicknames are short for the person's name anyway.

I know of someone called Norm, which is short for (e)norm(ous) because he's a big lad.

[Cloggie]

Hi,
Also any thoughts on where I can find BMD's for NI other than The Ulster Historical Foundation on AncestryIreland.com?

You could also try the BRS Genealogy site: Ulster Historical Foundation - Online Searching of Irish ancestral and genealogy records (Births, Deaths, Marriages) for Co. Antrim & Co. Down
I think it contains the same records as AncestryIreland but it also searches for variations of surnames (for example Magee / McGee), whereas AncestryIreland only appears to search for the surname exactly as entered.

It also allows you to narrow down your search to a particular parish. But it doesn't give the father's name in the search results like AncestryIreland does. But if you do find the name you're looking for, you can often use the two sites together to narrow your search results (by finding the right parish & right father's name).

[Rachel Scand]

The only names I could find anywhere near it are Italian .... Massimo (Maximus) and Massimiliano (Maximilian)

Behind the Name: Names Beginning With M

[Little Nell]

I could only think it might be for Maxim, but it may be a nickname based on something unrelated to his proper name. I don't suppose his surname was Ferguson, was it??!!

[tinkerbe]

in my tree massie= mercy female name

[margaretmarch]

thank you all

Hi everyone,
Thanks for the comments and thoughts.

My searches are around 1875 +/- 10 years for my grandfather James Todd Nugent (he was 33 when he married in 1909) and his siblings, but nothing comes up on either of the Ulster sites for his birth or any others with the father Robert. I know his father is Robert from the marriage record to my grandmother Rosina Gowdy in 1909.

The family was centred on the Shankill area of Belfast and they were Protestant.

I have found some marriage records for 2 sisters of grandfather:
1. Mary Elizabeth (Minnie) Nugent who married William Herbert Howells 1913 and then David Beattie in 1920 (confirmed by cousin's knowledge)
2. Edith Armstrong Nugent who married George Cotter (confirmed by cousin's and own knowledge).

One other source that might help is from the Royal Irish Rifles of which grandfather was regular soldier (he is noted as this on the marriage certificate). He would have been too old to serve in WW1 but I wonder if there are any other army records I could search.

If anyone can give any pointers that would be great, but it looks like a trip to Belfast is needed!
Thanks again to everyone.
Margaret

[KiteRunner]

Looking at the UHF / Ancestry Ireland site, it does say that their civil birth registrations for Belfast are incomplete at the moment. They do have a Mary Eliza Nugent birth listed, father Robert, county Antrim, in 1889. The only Edith Nugent on the site does have father Robert and county Antrim but her name is Edith Helen McGregor A Nugent (1896) - but the A could stand for Armstrong so it might well be worth paying to view?

[KiteRunner]

When you search on the UHF website you have to enter a first name as well as a surname which is annoying if you don't know what name you're searching for, but it does at least give you the father's name if you get a match. So I have found a couple of Robert Nugents, father Robert - 1885 and 1890. I'm just thinking that if Uncle Massie's real name was Robert then he could have had the nickname to distinguish him from his father?

[KiteRunner]

Oh, but of course on the IFHF site you don't have to enter a first name, but then it doesn't tell you the father's name on there, so if I were you I would search for the surname Nugent, county Antrim, on the IFHF site (in 8-year chunks), note down the first names, and then check them on the UHF site to see which ones have father's name Robert. Hope that makes sense!

[Northern Light]

I have a Massie in my tree.

His name is Matthew and was born Co Roscommon. My second cousin is also known as Massie and hes a Matthew with Irish parents..

[KiteRunner]

Oh, Light, you may have cracked it! The UHF site has a Matthew Nugent birth listed in County Antrim, 1884, father's name Robert.

[margaretmarch]

Brilliant everyone!!
I had vaguely thought it could have been Matthew softened to Massie as opposed to Mattie/Matt. All the family seemed to have the 'ie' put on the end of their names eg my father's brother 'Uncle Jamsie' and a cousin Geordie (George) as I knew them!

I have also now found a site (Belfast Family History - Home Page) with the Belfast 1901 and 1911 censuses transcribed on it! If anyone else is looking for Belfast families this looks to be a good source of info. I have found a Nugent family on the 1911 in the street where my father was born in 1916, not the same house and not showing the name of his brother born 1909 but I will have a good look at this entry and see if anything strikes a note.

Great progress today thanks a lot for all your help and spurring me on.
Margaret

[Cloggie]

That looks like a great site Margaret! I've added it to the Wiki: Northern Ireland - Family Tree Forum

[margaretmarch]

Cloggie, Thanks for doing that, I didn't know how so thought if I mentioned it someone more expert would pick it up.

Everyone,
I have spent the afternoon going through the entries on the 1901 and 1911 census for my name of Nugent and I am convinced they are my family and there are more of them than previously thought!
It's been a really exciting afternoon finding so much and I now need to absorb it all.
The name of Matthew does not appear in either census group but maybe that will turn up elsewhere now I have more to go on.

Thanks for the support.
Margaret)