Advice on where to look for someone in PR's

[Joan of Archives]

I have several people in my tree, mostly from the early 1700's that do not appear in the Parish records before their marriage or children's baptism. They don't appear on the IGI either.

Any advice as to where to look prior to their appearance in a certain Parish? Do I just have to look at the nearest villages and gradual widen my search outwards until I come across a likely baptism or marriage?

Thanks

[Little Nell]

Yes! Unless you have definite proof that they come from elsewhere, ie in a settlement dispute or because you have a birthplace from 1851 census.

Of course their baptism might be on the IGI (I know you've checked, this is for others who might have same query) or you could just search on Freereg with county and not specify a parish IF you are certain they were from the same county.

IGI and Freereg are by no means comprehensive, but its a start.

[Joan of Archives]

Do you know Nell I have never found anything on Freereg !

Actually you may know this, being in Herts, the major problem is that mine all seem to have been bang on the Bucks/Herts border, the teeny weeny bit that is in Herts but sticks out into Bucks, lmho!

I found a marriage in Aldbury Herts in 1731 that I think may be mine, but he was in Aston Clinton Bucks from 1732. I guess that it is not that far away. I may have to go to Herts RO to look at the marriage; maybe it will give his name, & say of Aston Clinton, then I've cracked it, lol!

Still won't help find his baptism though :(

[Mary from Italy]

You could try the Records Office to see if they have any settlement or removal orders, or apprenticeships.

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

You could try the Records Office to see if they have any settlement or removal orders, or apprenticeships.

Without these I would say you are probably stuck (unless very unusual names or a helpful will turns up, or something)

Ever since I established my 4xgg Thomas SMITH (lol) married a woman form two counties away in 1786, I have struggled to accept the "widen the search until you find a match" system as reliable. If I had gone for the nearest match I would have picked the marriage in the nexdoor parish - right sort of date and right first name for the bride!

[KiteRunner]

Well, then you start looking for evidence to support or prove it being the right one, such as his father or other relative leaving a will that gives enough info about him, and look at his children's names to see if they are named after his parents and siblings.

[Guy]

There are various methods to use.
One is the expanding search you mention.
This could be modified by searching nearby market towns first, bearing in mind any hills, rivers etc. that could form an obstacle to travel.

It may also help to trace carriers routes as people often hitched a lift with carriers.

Employment; did your ancestors work for the aristocracy? If so they could have been moved from a distant family estate owned by that family.

Employment again ; did your ancestors work in a specific industry such as mining? Many miners etc. moved location when local pits closed and distant pits opened.
For example at different periods many miners moved from the Staffordshire coal field to Normanton, West Yorkshire when the Normanton pits were opened.
Cheers
Guy

[Phoenix]

Provided you are not tracing Smiths, it is worth looking at ANY indexes for the county. Wills, poor law, marriage licences, lists of freeholders for the 1700s, Hearth Tax, Association Oath, Free & Voluntary Present etc for 1600s.

Lots of these may not be on the internet, but in readily available books in larger libraries.

They can give you an idea of where a name might have originated.

Another possibility is that they are in the parish but not recorded - nonconformist, records not surviving, incompetent clerks, private baptisms not recorded etc.

People often crop up in manorial records. It would be worth looking to see if any survive.[records, not people!]

[Olde Crone Holden]

This is probably really stupid, but I'll say it anyway, for the benefit of less experienced researchers....check that the parish register you are consulting is complete in that all years are covered.

Also check for chapels of ease in the area, which sometimes mysteriously get put into more distant parishes, or only appear as BTs.

Otherwise, I use the concentric circle approach as I do not have anyone as common as a Smith in my family, lol, poor Merry.

OC

[Harrys mum]

This is probably really stupid, but I'll say it anyway, for the benefit of less experienced researchers....check that the parish register you are consulting is complete in that all years are covered.

Also check for chapels of ease in the area, which sometimes mysteriously get put into more distant parishes, or only appear as BTs.

Otherwise, I use the concentric circle approach as I do not have anyone as common as a Smith in my family, lol, poor Merry.

OC

Very good point OC.....and not just for the new researchers.

I've spent yonks looking for David Kirkby's baptism around 1730. I know from all sorts of records that's about the year.
Didn't think to check what years the PR covered!!!! Got his sister, though LOL.

[Olde Crone Holden]

The reason I mentioned it was because I spent ages looking for some "missing" baptisms on a LDS film of the PR.

It had been filmed rather haphazardly and I didn't notice there were some years missing until I read the blurb at the beginning of the film which told me that the church had burned down in 1761 and took seven years to rebuild, during which time everyone attended a nearby church in another parish!

It was catalogued as covering all years.

OC

[Asa]

I always try the county marriage index - you can often see a cluster of parishes where the surname is more common before or around the time you're looking at. I've found several that way.

[Janet]

I don't know how easy it is for you to get to your County of interest but I found I had to visit the CRO to find my missing links. This can be doubly awkward if you have ancestors living on the edge of county borders. My ancestors were living in one village in the 1800/1900's but I had to do a search to find them in the 1700's. I did this by looking closely at the family group in one village and noting that although some were getting married in that village they were not baptised in that village so I noted that a Francis, Jane, Elizabeth were baptised elsewhere around 1760 to 1775. So now looking for a certain timeframe and certain names I cast the net initially just 3 miles and looked for these names in all the surrounding parishes and I found them in another small hamlet just 2 miles away, bap 1763, 1769 and 1774. I had also found one in the Militia Lists for 1762 and 1777 from this same village and one who died in the village had been married in the other village. But then it got complicated because this village was only 1 mile from the Hunts border and another marriage took place on the Beds border so I had to visit Hunts/Beds CRO's to find other marriages and baptisms but by noting the names that turn up in one village you can then often trace the family to another village or hamlet. I had already noted that there was a Francis in every family not just every generation. Sometimes they marry in a completely different village and return to the original place. Mine were working in Manor Houses and so ended up going off with their employers to many places. One went with the Spencer family from Brington to Westminster and married there and returned via Bucks to Northants years later. I found him through about three Settlement Certificates in Northants CRO. Take note of where they work as I have found so many in estate books. Hardly any of mine are on the IGI so I would never have found mine that way.

Certainly Free Reg is getting better, but the records are still very sparse. Northants is quite good on free Reg but they are still light years away from completing this very valuable resource.

PS Aston Clinton and Aldbury are not that far away from each other. Both fairly near to Tring, which is Herts, but on the border with Bucks. Aston Clinton is Bucks.

Janet

[Joan of Archives]

Ooo thanks everybody!

What are "chapels of ease" OC ?

They aren't Smiths fortunately, I don't do Smiths,lol, it is a place name, Puttenham, that changes from that to Puttnam then Putnam :o

There is a will for a George Puttenham, yeoman, made in 1780 at Bucks RO that could possibly be him. I can send for a copy of it.

What did a Yeoman do?

I looked at Herts RO but there was only one a James Putnam he lived in Long Marston, & I have a copy of his will but no brother called George is mentioned. However he does mention a bequeath to his "sarvant mead" (sic) Hannah Reeve the daughter of William Reeve of Aston Clinton in the county of Bucks the sum of one hundred ? something because the copy is dreadful :(

I also have Reeve & Reeves from Aston Clinton in my tree strangely, lol!

[Olde Crone Holden]

A chapel of ease, was a small chapel built in a convenient location for those who were too far from the parish church to attend regularly. They rarely had a resident vicar, although sometimes there was a resident curate - depends!

They didn't always keep their own registers but again, it depends and you can't generalise.

A yeoman was basically a farmer of some standing, but historically it meant a man who possessed freehold land worth 40 shillings or more per annum, and meant he could serve on Juries and vote for the Knights of the Shire.

OC

[Guy]

I assume you have checked the Bishop's Transcripts before extending the search.
There are many cases of BTs holding information missing from parish Registers and vice versa.
Cheers
Guy

[Joan of Archives]

Hi Guy

No I hadn't thought of that, I will have to check those as well then!

Thanks!

[Janet]

Just thought of another one to check. I found a few Marriage Licences which gave me several different villages, so these are worth checking at the CRO'S.

Janet