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I have serveral people no Birth Certs

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  • I have serveral people no Birth Certs

    Would they be register somewhere else and not with GRO? from 1837 - 1930 ish

    They seem to have missed being registered anywhere

  • #2
    Until 1870 it wasn't compulsory to register a birth. After that still some births were not registered and a few didn't reach the GRO indexes. Also there's bound to be a few people registered in a different name to that they were known by, plus 101 other reasons for mis/non-registration.

    However, if the person was born in England/Wales I can't think that they could have been registered anywhere other than within the UK registration system.

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    • #3
      Perhaps they were registered as "Male" or "Female" if the parents hadn't decided what to call them.
      Uncle John - Passed away March 2020

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      • #4
        James

        There are over one million errors in the GRO system, according to a report I read.

        Mistranscriptions, mis-indexed, missing altogether. Many events, especially in the early years of the system, did not make it to the GRO.

        Put some up and let us have a go.

        OC

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        • #5
          James - you are looking at the images and not a transcription?

          There are still gaps in the transcriptions, and there's an illuminating article findable via a link from the home-page of Ukbmd.org.uk about the records that got lost between local and central indexes.

          Christine
          Researching: BENNETT (Leics/Birmingham-ish) - incl. Leonard BENNETT in Detroit & Florida ; WARR/WOR, STRATFORD & GARDNER/GARNAR (Oxon); CHRISTMAS, RUSSELL, PAFOOT/PAFFORD (Hants); BIGWOOD, HAYLER/HAILOR (Sussex); LANCASTER (Beds, Berks, Wilts) - plus - COCKS (Spitalfields, Liverpool, Plymouth); RUSE/ROWSE, TREMEER, WADLIN(G)/WADLETON (Devonport, E Cornwall); GOULD (S Devon); CHAPMAN, HALL/HOLE, HORN (N Devon); BARRON, SCANTLEBURY (Mevagissey)...

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          • #6
            Most of my work was done at the FRO Islington trawling through those lovely large ledgers from 1837 - to the present day alas it is now shut and the ledgers taken - BOO HOO

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            • #7
              Very often when somebody says they have somebody in their tree whose birth wasn't registered, after the time when it became compulsory I mean, it eventually does turn out that the person was registered but their name was different from the one they were later known by - usually because they were registered under their mother's previous surname but then known by the surname of the man that the mother later married. If you post up some examples of the ones you can't find (assuming the people aren't still alive) then you never know, we might be able to help.
              KiteRunner

              Every five years or so I look back on my life and I have a good... laugh"
              (Indigo Girls, "Watershed")

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              • #8
                Here is one

                William Thomas Ramswell died 1997 (70) Born 1927

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                • #9
                  James

                  The death is on Ancestry (probably where you got it) and curiously it doesn't have his birthdate on the entry, which implies that whoever registered the death didn't know his birthdate. Some mystery here, especially as by 1927 I think it would be much harder not to register a birth.
                  ~ with love from Little Nell~
                  Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                  • #10
                    Oh, yes. Looks as though the person who registered the death didn't give an exact date of birth for him, so it could be that they didn't know the exact year either and 1927 was a guess. Of course, if his birth was registered under a different surname then we would need more info to start looking really, especially as he is too late for censuses.

                    Or he could have been born in another country?
                    KiteRunner

                    Every five years or so I look back on my life and I have a good... laugh"
                    (Indigo Girls, "Watershed")

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Wondering about whether he had a pension, and if so, how he proved he was right age to be eligible.

                      I know my husband's gt grandfather had a problem in 1936 (not sure how it was resolved) as GRO couldn't find his birth registration. Not surprising as instead of being registered surname Carter he was registered as McCarthy and family changed their name about 4 years after his birth.
                      ~ with love from Little Nell~
                      Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

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                      • #12
                        Sounds like they guessed his age (a round number) so might be years out :o

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                        • #13
                          Just having a quick look before bedtime

                          There's a Thomas W Ramswell 1927 .... Southwark ... Mmn ...Welsh


                          can you give us more clues ?
                          ~ FOR PHOTO RESTORATIONS PLEASE SCAN AT A RESOLUTION OF 300-600 WITH THE SCALE AT 100% MINIMUM ~ http://restoreandcolour.brainwaving.co.uk

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                          • #14
                            Hi James, could he possibly be George below - if the informant did not know date of birth might also have wrong names - was he illegitimate possibly?-
                            Births Mar 1927
                            Ramswell George W
                            MMN Ramswell
                            Southwark 1d 89
                            ;) Helen x

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                            • #15
                              No I got from FRO Islington, I collected all the Ramwells I could find by going through BMD ledgers and I am putting them into a MS Word data base which is very useful as I can find groups of people at a glance.

                              I cannot find the birth of Harriet Ramswell she is on the 1901 Census aged 1

                              RG 13 Piece 363 Folio 111 Page 21 Schedule 129
                              Last edited by James; 03-06-08, 23:58.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Hi Rachel, Welsh ties in with a mar 1925 Marriage of Thomas Ramswell and Clara E Welsh

                                Helen, yes, I suspect George W is illegitimate, I have him marked as (RR3) Ramswell/Ramswell and he is the third one there are more!! I could not find a Ramswell/Ramswell marriage in the time scale.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Birth: Ann Ramswell
                                  1900 Jul-Aug-Sep St Saviour Southwark
                                  Volume: 1d Page: 36


                                  Right surname and registration, but although possible it is Harriet registered with alternative name, I am uncertain as age should be between 6 and 8 months, not a year.
                                  ~ with love from Little Nell~
                                  Chowns, Dunt, Emms, Mealing, Purvey & Smoothy

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Well, their other child on the 1901 is Joseph and it says he is 3, but the likely birth registration for him is Sep 1898, which would make him 2, so it could be that their ages were rounded up instead of down!

                                    But having said that, there is an Ann Ramswell age 8 months on the 1901 census born Southwark (daughter of Thomas and Clara), so she must be that Ann.
                                    Last edited by KiteRunner; 04-06-08, 08:34.
                                    KiteRunner

                                    Every five years or so I look back on my life and I have a good... laugh"
                                    (Indigo Girls, "Watershed")

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      1891:
                                      William Ramswell Head M 36(?) Smith's Labourer London Southwark
                                      Elizabeth Do Wife M 28 Furrier's Puller Do Do
                                      Do Do Daur 6(?) Scholar Do Do
                                      William Do Son 5(?) Do Do
                                      Sarah S Do Daur 4 Do Do
                                      Sarah A Do 5 mo Do Do

                                      1901:
                                      Wilm Ramswell Head M 44 Fish Curer Southwark
                                      Elizth Do Wife M 38 Do
                                      Joseph Do Son S 3 Do
                                      Harriet Do Daur S 1 Do

                                      Sorry, can't make out a lot of the ages properly because they have lines through them. But if this is the same couple on both censuses then it doesn't look as though their children's details are accurate on the censuses with those two Sarahs, does it? Tracing William back, there is a likely one who is the son of a Joseph, age 7 on the 1871 census. I can't see his marriage to Elizabeth, but I can't see his birth either and he has two brothers called Thomas on the 1871 census. This family looks as though they maybe have different census names from their official names!
                                      KiteRunner

                                      Every five years or so I look back on my life and I have a good... laugh"
                                      (Indigo Girls, "Watershed")

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Hope you don't mind me posting this here.

                                        James - you are looking at the images and not a transcription?
                                        Where do you see the images in England ----- I've have phoned register offices before and asked this each time I was told I can only see an index, just like on ancestry. I have always suspected that Jack was registered under a different name. I have his date of birth from his death certificate.

                                        I'm getting to go to England (Yorkshire) for 3 days this summer ----- it might be better use of my time going somewhere to looking at birth images.

                                        Jan

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