Certificate question.

[Harrys mum]

Do English marriage certs list the partners mothers' names?

It looks like only the fathers' names are listed. I'm looking at 1862.

If that is right, can anyone tell me how I'd find the correct person when there are more than one possibles but they all have the same father's name.

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

No mothers details are given. There is an illustrated wiki section devoted to certs and the details they contain.

http://www.familytreeforum.com/wiki/index.php/England_and_Wales_Certificates

If you are looking at more than one cert in your possession and want to try and decide which is yours then witnesses, occupation of the couple and their fathers might hold the key, also possibly the address at time of marriage.

If you are just looking at the index on a local bmd site or transcription of records then things are a bit more awkward as the "extra" details aren't available without the cert.

The best option is to try and follow the possible couples forward in the census, you might find that a visitor is an in-law or family member, this might help decide whether the marriage is one you need or not. Children born to a marriage might turn up at the house of a grandparent for example. Also try baptism records via the LDS site for potential children born to a couple, this allied to any census returns will give you family groups that can help search other trees for connections.

[Northern Light]

Yes your right Libby, only the fathers names are entered on the marr certs.

Have you tried tracing the witnesses, maybe they are relatives or neighbours..

Oooops sorry my post crossed with Glens..

[Harrys mum]

Thanks Light and Glen....

I have the right couple as I've traced them back. Just can't get further back as there are two possible Thomas Golders born Kent 1831, and both of the blighters have Thomas as father.

[Northern Light]

Libby is the fathers occupation or address of no help?

[Harrys mum]

Light.....my Thomas born 1831 was a Customs Clerk.

The possible fathers are a Mariner and a Tailor.

I'm hoping for the Tailor.

[KiteRunner]

But doesn't it say what his father's occupation was on his marriage certificate?

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Like Kite, I feel a bit confused!

Thomas Golder, customs clerk, in 1851 has father Thomas, a magistrate. So, do you mean this is the man you are hoping the marriage is for, but you don't have the cert yet, or perhaps the father's occ isn't recorded?

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

The same Thomas Golder is with his widowed mother (Jane) in 1861.

Please ignore me if I'm rambling on about the wrong people! lol

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

1861 again, there's a Thomas Golder with widowed mother Alice...Thomas is same age as the other one (near enough and born Folkestone, the same).....he is a mariner..........

Bit of an odd family before that as in 1841 Alice is in one household with no husband and dau Martha who is with her in 1861, whilst there's no Thomas in the 1841 household, but there is a Thomas with father Thomas a mariner in a different household, with possible wife for Thomas senr, Sarah!! I don't think you want that lot to be your family........far too complicated! lol

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Hmmm....I presume the marriage you have is to Eliza Maria Collings? I would have said the father of the groom would be the son of the magistrate. Virtually 100% given the differing occupations of the two possible men (the grooms.....customs clerk, but before and after the marriage for one and mariner for the other before the marriage, at least)

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

OOh, I've not seen the tailor yet!

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Libby, I think you should start with the 1851 census, as I'm sure these are the people you want, though dad Thomas may have had a change of occ and Jane may not be young Thomas' mother......

That uncle in the house may make all the difference to sorting them out.....

Thomas Golder 68 magistrate
Jane Golder wife 52
Thomas Golder son 20 customs clerk (he has this occ in 1861 too)
John Butcher uncle 86 retired gentleman blacksmith (lol, that's lovely!)
Ann Hammond serv 16

All the family b Folkestone

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Ah! Got it now, the magistrate was previously a tailor!

My guess is the occ is not on the marriage cert and that's why you feel stuck. Personally I think the tailor is very much the right father! lol

[Harrys mum]

Thanks Merry....sorry been doing grandson duties (and reading wills on the side) LOL.

This is my sister in law's family. I know Thomas Collings Golder is hers. He's born 1869.

I know his father is Thomas Golder (b 1831)and his mother is Eliza Maria Collings. They married in 1862 from memory.

Where I'm stuck is with Thomas (b 1831) parents. There is a Thomas and Jane who I feel are his parents, mainly because he keeps his year of birth as 1831 right through all the census. Don't ask why that impresses me LOL.

I'm tracing this lot back from Nettie Hutchinson (nearly always transcribed as Nellie) born Guernsey.
Her bother came to Australia and his daughter was named Nettie. The Australian Nettie Hutchinson also married a Golder in Tasmania. It tickled my fancy having an aunt marrying someone of the same surname and I had to find the connection.

Haven't yet!!!!

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Where I'm stuck is with Thomas (b 1831) parents. There is a Thomas and Jane who I feel are his parents, mainly because he keeps his year of birth as 1831 right through all the census. Don't ask why that impresses me LOL.

lol!! I expect he kept the right birth year because he was literate and his occ of customs clerk meant he was used to facts and figures etc. I think he's the right one because he had the same occ at marriage as he did for the previous 20 years and also afterwards.

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

It tickled my fancy having an aunt marrying someone of the same surname and I had to find the connection.

Haven't yet!!!!

lol! Not that common a surname is it?