Jane Stewart From scotland to manchester

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

CAn anyone help me? I am trying to trace Jane Stewart's relatives. I have her marriage Certificate 1863 St Marks Hulme manchester which states her father is James Stewart Game Keeper (what a name to have to search scotland for!!!). In the 1861 census Jane(born 1838) is living in Hulme with her future husband John Japp and their child Mary (1860). Census states they are both from Scotland. I cant find Jane on England or Scotland census for 1851 and I cant find her Father on England or Scotland 1861 census as a gamekeeper (I can find lots of James Stewarts though!!!).

I have been stumped on this for a long while now

[KiteRunner]

Hi Vicky and welcome,
This could be a tough one! Have you found Jane on any censuses after 1861? (or did she die before 1871?) It would be helpful if we could find her on one where her birthplace is more specific than just "Scotland", wouldn't it? Or if she ever has any relatives with her on census night. Oh, I know - who were the witnesses at her wedding?

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

Hi Kite runner

I can trace her forwards until her death in 1916. in the other census' her birth place is listed as glasgow, paisley and hulme so not very helpful. i have one record of her staying with her inlaws when her son died but that was in abbey renfrew scotland. the witnesses from what i can gather are just people that they either knew or were from the church as their names are william and fanny corkhill and they dont show up anywhere else

[KiteRunner]

Well, I would say Glasgow and Paisley are very helpful as they narrow it down a lot (Paisley is very near Glasgow, isn't it?)
There is a Jane Stewart age 13 in Paisley on the 1851 census with father James (age 54, born Paisley, wife Elizabeth who is 53 born Irvine, Ayrshire) but his occupation is Spirit Dealer, according to ancestry. He could have changed occupations, of course. I wonder if we can find that family on the 1861 and see if that Jane is still with her parents or not?

[Just Gillian]

Hello Vicky and welcome to the forum.

From your knowledge of John Japp's family, is there any indication that John and Jane followed the Scottish naming tradition?

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

Thanks kite runner i will try that. I have to admit that i had thought maybe her mum might have been called margaret as it was custom to name the children after family and her children were Mary (after husbands mum), James(after Janes father), Margaret, Matthew(after Husbands father), John (after husband). But i could be very wrong.
It also doesnt help that i dont know scotland at all.

This will serve me right for not starting my tree until after my mother died as she would probably have known!!

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

Hi Just Gillian

Not quite sure what the tradition for naming was but have put the names above as i thought it was following some tradition

[Just Gillian]

Vicky - if they stuck to the tradition, the first son should have been named after John's father, second son after Jane's, first daughter after Jane's mother, second after John's.

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

have just checked 1841 census for the jane that kiterunner suggested, that jane had a sister margaret to it could be a possibility, also jane was not there on 1861 and james worked in iron works. Janes husband John Japp was an iron moulder.

[KiteRunner]

I haven't been able to find them in 1861, sorry. Of course, Elizabeth might not be Jane's mother as she could be James's second wife, so then I started looking for them in 1841 but not been able to definitely find the right family. You probably need to go back and forth between the censuses looking at each possible Jane. I've got to go out now, but back later...

I see we were posting at the same time. Well, that sounds possible.

[Just Gillian]

Vicky - I've had a look at the censi but nothing is leaping out at me I'm afraid. The fact that Jane is so often interchangeable in Scotland with Jean doesn't help either.

Unfortunately by 1851 there are quite a few Jane/Jean Stewarts living as servants away from their families.

[BigShaz McCreadie]

Hi

I've only scanned this thread so far so it may already have been mentioned but Paisley comes under Renfrewshire and not Lanarkshire which is of course where Glasgow is

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

so are these places far apart? Her husband came from Abbey which i think is paisley?

[BigShaz McCreadie]

Abbey also comes under Renfrew

They aren't exactly far away and on a good day it would only take about 10mins in the car along the M8 from Glasgow to Paisley.

Glasgow Airport is actually nearer to Paisley than Glasgow.

People from Paisley wouldn't like to mistaken for Glaswegians though and vice versa

But when it comes to research it's better to know that one is Renfrewshire and the other Lanarkshire because it will help to narrow it down.

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

I have found jane on the 1871 England census but she is Named as Jean! could be the accent.

[KiteRunner]

I would think that she actually came from Paisley but when she had moved away from Scotland, if she said she came from Paisley people would not have heard of it so she said Glasgow because it was the nearest place to Paisley that people would have heard of.

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

that sounds quite probable and would also give her a link with the census record that you found for me.

[Lindyloo]

john jap

have just checked 1841 census for the jane that kiterunner suggested, that jane had a sister margaret to it could be a possibility, also jane was not there on 1861 and james worked in iron works. Janes husband John Japp was an iron moulder.

Hi vicky glad youve joined us, its a great site, just like to mention that i am trying tofind more about john Thornton my greatgrandfather he lived in Hulme around the same time as your John jap and worked in the foundry as a striker its a small world,

[vicky taylor-bradbury]

hi Lindyloo
do you know which foundry and if so how did you find out?