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  • This may sound crazy but..

    would anyone like to help.

    I've just bought a copy of Mayhew's London labour London Poor. I opened it at random and started reading about Edward Albert a negro crossing sweeper. He had been a ships cook and had lost both his legs while at sea in 1851. Mayhews reports were published in 1861. So he was interviewed somewhere between those dates. I just wanted to find out if he was "real" so started looking for some records.

    Edward Albert was born in Jamaica. His wfe (not named) he described as "the same colour as me but English and from Leeds" They had a three month old son James Edward Albert. I've found a possible birth registration for James Edward Albert in St Giles 1856. Haven't found a marriage for sure.

    I think I've spotted them on the 1861 census living somewhere in Yorkshire. But I haven't got an Ancestry subscription at the moment to see the image. Would someone like to have a look for me and find out what it says about the family.

    They are nothing to do with my family. I'm just curious. There is so much information given about this man it would be really interesting for anyone researching the family.

  • #2
    If you PM me your e-mail address I think I've found the image He was born kingstown Jamaica, says a Traveller, his wife Manchester, son James 6 London, daughter Sophia 4, Isle of Wight, daughter Ellen 1 Manchester.
    .
    Last edited by Durham Lady; 26-03-08, 15:36.
    Daphne

    Looking for Northey, Goodfellow, Jobes, Heal, Lilburn, Curry, Gay, Carpenter, Johns, Harris, Vigus from Cornwall, Somerset, Durham, Northumberland, Cumberland, USA, Australia.

    Comment


    • #3
      On the 1861 census Edward Albert is a traveller from Kingstown, Jamaica, his wife Ellen is from Manchester. They are staying at 10 Water Lane, Huddersfield in a lodging house.

      Looks as if he married Ellen Buchanan June Q 1961 Sheffield.

      If you would like any more information, please let me know.

      Elaine
      Last edited by Elaine59-; 26-03-08, 15:33.
      Looking for: Bassick/Beswick in Lancashire, Wolverhampton, Durham - Bradshaw & Drage in Bozeat & London - Rainbow, Strange, Maginess, Northcote, Thompson, Bartlett & Wheeler in London - Harrington, Gusterson & Sach in Essex

      Comment


      • #4
        Thanks very much. I've sent you a pm with my email address.

        I had seen the marriage to Ellen Buchanan and thought that the most likely although he says in the interview that he has been married two years and as the baby was 3 months at the time the marriage would have been 1854.

        He was trying to get compensation from the ship owners for his injuries. He worked as a crossing sweeper in the winter because the cold numbed the pain in his legs. In the summer they hurt too much so he had to beg. He said his wife did everything for him and he couldn't manage without her. It really brought their story to life.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thanks very much. I've recieved the image.

          I don't suppose I'll find out any more about this family. I'm thinking Ellen was perhaps a second wife, mother of the baby. I've found a birth reg for Eliza Ellen Albert in Manchester in 1860. Can't find anything for Sophia.

          No doubt there'll be loads more people I get interested in as I read more of the book. Thanks for your help.

          Comment


          • #6
            Daphne has kindly sent me three census images 61, 71 and 81. Using those and freebmd this is what I have so far

            Edward Albert b. about 1829 Kingston, Jamaica
            Wife: Ellen Buchanan b. abt 1834 Manchester. Marr. 1861 Sheffield
            (Her parents James Buchanan b.Africa and Mary)
            Children
            James Edward Albert b. 1856* St Giles London
            Sophia b. 1857, Isle of Wight (no birth reg found) poss death 1861 Sheffield
            Ellen b. 1860* Manchester. Poss death 1861
            Jane b. 1863 Scotland. Married James Bartley 1881 Preston
            Henry b. 1867* Newcastle. Living with grandparents in 1881
            Esther b. 1870* Newcastle. poss marriage 1890 John Downham or George Hindle
            Edward b.1872* Newcastle
            Mary b.1877* Bradford

            In 1881 Ellen is on her own with the children in Preston. But there is a Edmund Albert , born Jamaica, living in Blackburn with a child Thomas born 1875* Bradford. Could this be Edward?

            The birth dates with * are the ones that I've found a matching birth registration.

            Comment


            • #7
              remember to consider that even though the reports were published in 1861 they could have actually been written over the course of many years. So the ages given were probably correct at the time Mayhew spoke to his subjects it's just years later when he puts it all together
              Zoe in London

              Cio che Dio vuole, io voglio ~ What God wills, I will

              Comment


              • #8
                Pat, I've found Jane's registration in Scotland. I had a few credits left over. Sending an e-mail to you.
                Daphne

                Looking for Northey, Goodfellow, Jobes, Heal, Lilburn, Curry, Gay, Carpenter, Johns, Harris, Vigus from Cornwall, Somerset, Durham, Northumberland, Cumberland, USA, Australia.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by SussexPat View Post
                  In 1881 Ellen is on her own with the children in Preston. But there is a Edmund Albert , born Jamaica, living in Blackburn with a child Thomas born 1875* Bradford. Could this be Edward?
                  In my experience, Edmund/Edwin/Edward are interchangable on the census. Edwin/Edward are most likely to be the same person. Edmund is likely a mis-transcription or enumeration error.

                  It is plausible that there was a son born 1875 Bradford, given Mary born 1877 Bradford.

                  Births Jun 1875
                  ALBERT Thomas Frederick
                  Bradford 9b 130
                  Tracy

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thanks for your replies.

                    There was also a baby Sophie Albert who was born and died in Bradford close to the ages of Thomas and Mary. She could also have been their child as they had already lost one daughter called Sophie.

                    I haven't been able to find any information on them after 1881 apart from the possible marriage of Esther in 1890.

                    I haven't read much of the book yet but it is going to be fascinating. I have ancestors from the Bethnal Green/Spitalfields area and the Camberwell area. I'm not expecting to find my ancestors in the book. LOL. But I think it will give me a good idea how they lived. Many of the descriptions are quite general about groups of people and even where people are interviewed they are not usually named. Edward Albert is interesting because two clear facts are given, the full name of his baby son and a little booklet he had printed about his experience at sea which is quoted in full and dated 6 October 1852. I've only been able to find one birth registration for James Edward Albert between 1852 and 1861 when Mayhew's book was published.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      What an interesting sounding book. Don't suppose you could scan the index and post it on here? Others may find useful references for their own families.
                      Paul Barton, Special Agent

                      Hear my themetune on http://www.turnipnet.com/radio/dickbarton.wav

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Here's a link to the book.

                        Henry Mayhew, London Labour and the London Poor: Volume 2

                        and the contents page.


                        Henry Mayhew, London Labour and the London Poor: Volume 2
                        Wendy



                        PLEASE SCAN AT 300-600 DPI FOR RESTORATION PURPOSES. THANK YOU!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Edward Albert is my gr-gr grandfather my gr grandfarther is Thomas albert born Bradford 1875 died Blackburn Lancashire 1947.
                          i dont know when Edward died the the last census he appears on is 1891 living in Preston Lancs he must have had his name miss quoted (Edward Alberti) at the end of his line on the census it is stated that he is a cripple he died between 1891 &1900.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            The link to the book no longer works.

                            Here is an updated link: http://hdl.handle.net/10427/14951

                            Edward Albert's story is at the bottom of the page "Of the Aduult Crossing sweeper"

                            Bob
                            http://buswalks.co.uk

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              I was surprised to see my old thread pop up again as I have just started work on the Albert/Buchanan family again. I found Edwards story so interesting that I couldn't resist trying to find out more about his life. There are still so many unanswered questions.

                              albert70 - if you see this post, I have a death certificate which I believe may be Edward's. Also other information but I must admit more gaps than knowledge.

                              I have to go out this morning but I will look back to this thread later today.

                              Oh and I was planning to ask for some help regarding this family so I will be back with questions.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                That is fine.
                                I have been looking at my family tree now for the last couple of years the reason your may be struggling is because at some point between 1901 & 1903 my family's name changed from Albert to Alberts it may always have been Alberts I don't know for sure.
                                My name is Neil Alberts by the way.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Hello Neil

                                  I think I was so surprised this morning that I didn't register how exciting it is to hear from the descendent of someone I read about in a historical document and who I have researched out of historical interest.

                                  You must feel very lucky that their is so much information about your ancestor in Mayhew's book. I wish I had that sort of information about my ancestors.

                                  I am going to see if I can post my timeline of my research so far.

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    TIMELINE

                                    The Jamaican Crossing sweeper.

                                    1808c James Buchanan was born either in Africa (1881 census) or Antigua (1851 census)

                                    1829c Edward Albert was born in Kingston, Jamaica. (birth year taken from census)

                                    1837c Ellen Buchanan was born in Manchester, Lancs, England (birth year taken from census)

                                    1841 Ellen Buchanan, with mother Elizabeth and sibling John? On the census in Manchester. Mother’s occupation Hawker.

                                    1850 James Buchanan married Catherine Connor. I have cert. His occupation given as hawker.

                                    1851 Ellen Buchanan, possibly, lodging with Clavering family at 1 Albion Buildings, St Judes district Manchester. She was a weaver, age 14.




                                    1851 James Buchanan born Antigua with wife Catherine (formally Connor) at 5 York Street, Leeds. He is described as a labourer and Catherine as “at mill” He is aged 45.



                                    1851 February – Edward Albert engaged to serve as a cook on the barque Madeira, captain J. Douglas.
                                    1851 June – Edward Albert afflicted with frost-bite.
                                    1852 Edward was in Glasgow.

                                    1856 James Edward Albert born in London the son of Edward Albert and Ellen Buchanan.

                                    1856 – Edward Albert was interviewed by Henry Mayhew three months after the birth of his child.
                                    1857-1859 Sophia Albert born in the Isle of Wight – no record found.
                                    1860 – registration of birth of Eliza Ellen Albert in Manchester, possibly “Ellen” on the 1861 census.

                                    1861 – 10, Water Lane, Huddersfield- Edward Albert, wife Ellen, children James 6, Sophia 4, Ellen 1. (James would only have been 5. No birth registration found for Sophia in the Isle Of Wight between 1857 and 1859)



                                    1861 June quarter- Edward Albert married Ellen Buchanan in Sheffield RD . Although he told Mayhew they had married 2 years before the interview.

                                    1861- Deaths of Ellen 1 and Sophia 4 in Sheffield.

                                    1862 Jane Albert born November in Edinburgh.

                                    1865- probably in Newcastle (twins Mary and Joseph born and died)
                                    1867 – Henry Albert born in Newcastle.

                                    1870- Esther Albert born January in Newcastle.

                                    1871 – Hanover Street, Newcastle. Edward Albert, hawker born Kingston Jamaica age 42, wife Ellen , general servant, born Manchester age 38, children – James, glassmaker, born London age 15, Jane, born Scotland age 8, Henry born Newcastle age 3, Esther born Newcastle age 1.

                                    1871 – probable death Catherine Buchanan. Can’t find James Buchanan on census.

                                    1872 – Edward Albert born Newcastle.

                                    1875– Thomas Albert born Bradford, Yorks

                                    1874 James Buchannan married Mary Williams, York RD

                                    1878 – Mary Albert born Bradford.

                                    1881- Jane Albert married James Bartley in Preston.

                                    1881 – 20, Queen Street, Blackburn. Lodging house. Edward Albert, seaman, born Jamaica, West Indies and Thomas Albert aged 4 born Bradford. (Thomas would have been 5 or 6)
                                    1881 – 9 Kings Yard, Walmgate, York. James Buchanan, age 73, race card hawker, born Africa. Wife Mary Buchanan, age 64 born Rawmarsh, Yorkshire and Henry Albert, age 14 born Newcastle, grandson. Yard of a pub I think.
                                    1881 – 10, Stoney Gate, St Johns, Preston. Ellen Albert, age 40 born Manchester. Children Esther 13 (11) and Edward 7(8 or 9), born Newcastle, Mary 3 born Bradford and daughter Jane 20 (19) born Scotland with husband James Bartley 19 born Bradford, hawker out of employ.
                                    1881- 6 Jolly’s Yard Bradford. James Albert 26, born London, a dyer.

                                    1882- Death of James Albert in Preston.

                                    1884 probable death of James Bartley 24 in Preston.

                                    1886 – death of James Buchanan in York.

                                    1887 – death of Mary Buchanan in York

                                    1890- 11th October Esther Albert married John Downham, St Luke, Preston.

                                    1891 – 3, Au***** Sq, Syke Hill, Preston, John Downham, 20, Brewer and Esther Downham (nee Albert) 20. Her birth place given as Birmingham???

                                    1891- 5, Au****** Sq, Syke Hill, Preston. Ellen Alberti, 57, born Manchester, Henry Alberti, 23, Blacksmith born Newcastle, Edward Alberti 15(he would have been 18 or 19), Cart Driver, born Newcastle, Thomas Alberti, 16, Cart Driver born Bradford, Mary Alberti 13.
                                    ((EDWARD ALBERTI, 53, born United States, cripple – I don’t believe he was at home but that one of the family gave his details (wrongly) as head of house.))

                                    1891 –19-20 East End, Higher Fore street, Redruth, Cornwall,lodging house. Edward Albert was lodging here along with a number of pedlars, hawkers and a travelling musician.

                                    1892 – death of Edward Albert registered Falmouth, Cornwall. I have the cert.

                                    1892 – Mary Downham born Preston. Daughter of Esther and John.

                                    1894 – Dorothy Downham born Wigan.

                                    1895 – Eileen Downham born Preston.

                                    1896 - Sidney Downham born Preston

                                    1898 – Frances Albert born Preston – don’t know who her parents are.

                                    1898 – Margaret Downham born Preston.

                                    1900 – Henry Downham born Preston.

                                    1900 – Thomas Albert married Eva Cardingley Lancaster. Have cert.

                                    1901- possible death of Ellen Albert.(Preston) I couldn’t find her on 1901 census.

                                    1901- 60, Albert Street, Preston. Esther Downham 29 born Newcastle, her children Mary 9, Dolly 8, Eileen 7, Sidney 6, Margaret 4, Henry 1. Her brother Henry Albert 32, b. Newcastle, general labourer, and Thomas Albert 24, b.Bradford and his wife Eva 22 b. Bradford. Also Frances Albert age 4, Esther’s niece.

                                    1901 – Hr Audley St, Blackburn. John Downham (Esther’s husband) 31, mill engine lighter, visiting his sister Janet Bury.

                                    1901 – Edward Albert married Sarah Jane Rowe, Chorlton. Not found on census. Have cert.

                                    1902 – Thomas Albert(s) born Lancaster, son of Thomas Albert and Eva.

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      WOW
                                      That is good stuff Thomas & Eva are my grate grandparents, Thomas was a Gardener at Lancaster Castle they had 5 children all born in Lancaster one died just a baby I think his name was William, Thomas 1902-1982 Edward 1903-1988 Alfred (my grandfather) 1907-1990 & Eva 1914-1995.
                                      Frances was the only daughter of Mary but was raised by Esther & john Downham she died in 1980.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        Thanks for the information about Frances Albert. I nearly sent for her birth certificate. Do you know what happenned to Mary? I can't find her after 1901.

                                        I am really puzzled about Eva Cardingley. Do you know anything about her? I have her marriage certificate and it gives her father's name as George Cardingley. I have searched the census with every possibility I can think of for spelling her name and with various dates of birth but nothing turns up before her marriage to Thomas Albert(s) in 1900.

                                        If anyone else is reading this perhaps someone could help with the search for Eva. On the 1901 and 1911 census her place of birth is Bradford and date of birth between 1877 and 1879.

                                        Also on the marriage cert it says that Thomas was a widower but I can't find an earlier marriage for him.

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