Pioneers from England to the USA, in the 1860's

[Sandra]

Hi

I was speaking to an old friend on Saturday night about family history etc, and he asked if I could find out anything on his family as he never knew his grandparents. All I had to go on was his Dad's death, so yesterday after I came back from the Bracknell FH fair I made a start.

I found his Dad's death (2000) which lead to his birth (1917) which showed mothers maiden name. I found his grandparents marriage in 1916, which of course led me straight to the 1901 census, which showed his g-grandfather (Arthur Ashall) being born in America.

Now heres a weird thing, his g-g-grandfather married in 1864 in Sheffield, then went to America, must have been 1864/65 time, as their first child Matilda was born in 1866 in Black Rock, Nevada. The other children were born as follows -

Arthur (his g-granddad) b1867, Black Rock, Nevada
Matthew b1869 Toledo, Ohio
Hannah b1872 Buffalo, New York
Charlotte b1874, Providence, Rhode Island, New York
Hugh b1877, Sabrina b1880 and Louisa b1881 were all born in Wharncliffe Side, Sheffield, Yorkshire.

In the 1881 census, the family are all living in Bradfield, Sheffield.
RG11/4619 folio 61 page 7

Now what would make a File Cutter in the 1860's, move from Sheffield, right across the USA, to the blistering heat of the Nevada desert? Then make their way back home again?

I have been googling all afternoon, and seen they had silver mines in Black Rock at that time, also they were building the railway and blasting through a mountain then, although they seemed to be using just Chinese people for labouring.

What an adventure! I have had visions of 'How the West was Won' with them all in a long wagon train, and shouts of 'Injuns'. It must have been a very dangerous journey, the sea crossing alone, then the journey across America.

1864 to 1874 was still quite early on in the cowboy days wasn't it. Also is 3 years about the right timescale for such an epic trip?

I don't know what port they sailed from.. probably Liverpool, via Ireland? I don't know where they entered America... again probably New York, I have searched the Ellis Island site but 1864/66 is too early for their records.

It just seems so strange that they came back to England... how did they afford it, with an extra 5 passages to pay for, maybe he did go for the mines, and found some silver?

Do you think that as maybe he was a metalworker, he may have mined the silver in Black Rock? I know Sheffield had huge metalworks factories in the 1860's.

My friend is over the moon with all this info. He text me saying 'Howdy ma'am' and told me he now needs to buy a stetson!

If anyone reading this has the full Ancestry sub, as I only have the UK one, could they do a search on Matthew and Emma Ashall please, as I would love to find a trace of them in America.

Sandra

[Olde Crone Holden]

Sandra

Although I can't help with the specifics, it was really very common for whole families to upsticks and go to the USA.

There were hundreds of schemes available, from Government sponsored ones, to little local church groups, to pay the fares. Many Employers also saw a golden opportunity to expand their businesses and sent teams of workers over to the US to set up operations.

Many came back, as you have discovered - they didn't like it, or they missed home too much.

But it is no great mystery why they went - it was presented as a wonderful opportunity and many of those who went and stayed, did very well for themselves.

I have an ancestor who was foreman at a woollen mill in Lancashire. He and his family went to Prussia for 8 years, where his employer had built a new woollen mill and presumably shipped out his best workers to oversee the operation and train the local people.

Good luck with your researches.

OC

[Sandra]

Hi OC

I didn't realise that employers sent them away sometimes. That might explain it a bit, maybe he was sent to work on the railway then?

After they came back he was still working in the metal industry in Sheffield, so were his children - electro-plating, making spoons, forks etc.

I don't know if I could have stuck it out in that heat with small babies etc. No wonder they came home.

Sandra

[Meridian Line]

Hi Sandra,

I've got a family that left Lancashire in 1863 for the US. They had 5 children including a 1 year old. He was a brick maker, but became a farmer in Utah.
I managed to find the ship they sailed, Liverpool to New York, when there was a 3 day Ancestry Worldwide subscription.
As it was Utah they ended up, I assume they went with the mormons, his widowed half sister had emigrated through them in 1854, with her 3 teenaged children.
I've always found it fascinating that they would set off into the unknown, with babes in arms.

To contemplate doing the return journey must have been mind blowing!

[Darksecretz]

you could try the new beta test site from the LDS

you do have to register BUT they do have FREE images of the census on it..

FamilySearch Record Search

[daisiesinmay]

By the 1860's travel right across America was well established, the trails were mapped out and signposted and many settlements had been set up to service the wagon trains by supplying food, clothing and animals, wheelwrights, etc. It was no longer the Wild West by that time, every river had ferries established and many people were travelling in both directions.

The real Pioneers were the trains of the 1830's and 1840's, these people were usually guided by enterprising men who had already ridden right across to Oregon and California, although sometimes these men were charlatans and were such bad guides that people perished. ( for instance the ill fated Donner party - reknowned for eating their friends to stave off starvation when they were snowed in)

The Mormons, of course had their own trains and settlements, eventually building their famous city in Salt Lake. In the '50's and later there were huge numbers of Mormons and would be Mormons travelling from all over Europe.

Every adult who made the journey was allocated one half of a square mile of land by the Government , so a married couple were allocated a square mile and many men married in order to gain the larger parcel of land! But many people did return home, often working purely to save the return fare, while others of course became successful and stayed!

[Olde Crone Holden]

By happychance I tripped over (literally) a pile of old church mags for an obscure little church in Darwen, Lancs.

The magazine was extremely parochial (Mrs Haworth, wife of Mr James Howarth, has been confined to the house for the last month with a most troublsesome cough).

It also published letters from "our friends in Oregon". This appears to be a loosely related family group of about 30 people, who had gone to Oregon, courtesy of a sustained fund raising exercise by the said church. The letters told of the groups hardships and successes in the 1860s. Most of them took their handlooms with them and there is a lot about the price of cotton and how much they were getting for their qork - they were also farming too, of course.

I know from later research that many of this original group returned to Darwen - but many didn't and there continued to be reports about them, both in the church mag AND the local paper for many years afterwards.

Many Workhouses also enthusiastically paid for the passage of their able bodied inmates - women were particularly highly prized as there was such a shortage of marriageable women out there. Officially, the women were supposed to be "of respectable repute and free from ailment" but in practice - if they could stand up, they could go.

OC

[Sandra]

Just a quick update -

a lovely man on the records board over the road, has found Matthew returning to America in 1885 on his own 9 years after they came back, on the ship City of Richmond.

I wondered why I couldn't find him in the 1901 census, I couldn't find his death either and Emma still describes herself as married.

So that must mean he was sent to work over there as OC first suggested.

Thanks everyone for your interest.

Sandra

[AianC]

I seem to have a surfeit of emigrants..... to Ohio in the 1830's, to Iowa a generation later and to Australia and New Zealand (at least) in the 1860's.

The wonder is that so few of us are left to record the 'stay-at-homes' who are left to pick up the pieces of our emigrant cousins.

What continues to amaze me is the size, and survival rates, of the families who left these shores - families of 17+ children iseems to be the norm, and these are not the exception, in many of these cases

[WendyP]

HI Sandra


Not certain this is your man but half fits and half doesn't


1865 on board the Moravian heading into Maine Usa final destination of these Ashall's is Buffalo

Mathew Ashall 49 Occ Farmer
Anne Ashall 48
Henry Ashall age a bit blurry not sure if it read 40 or 10
Mathew Ashall 23 Occ Labourer
Emma Ashall 21

MIght just be coincidence

[Sandra]

Hi Wendy

Thats strange.

Matthew (b1844) parents were -

Matthew Ashall b1808 & Charlotte Hulse, who married in 1828 in Bradfield Yorks.
Their other children were -
Martha b1836, Louisa b1841, Henry b1843 and Sabina b1846, (as well as Matthew b1844 who went to America twice).

This family were in Sheffield in 1841, 1851 & 1861. He was also a File Cutter. So it couldn't be them..... could it?

Does it say on the ships manifest where in England they came from? As the names are so close that they might have been related somehow.

I'm going to seach the census's now to see if I can find this family that you have mentioned.

When we get back to Matthew Ashall b1808, he and his siblings are on the IGI, so maybe this family is too.

Thank you for the new lead.

Sandra

[WendyP]

HI Sandra

I have looked again at the image

Matthew the eldest is ditto as being a Farmer
Ann is shown as Wife to Matthew

Henry is shown as a Labourer

and Matthew the younger is ditto as bieng a Labourer
Emma is shown as Spinster


So I think that this may not be your man after all

If however you would like a copy of the manifest just PM me your e-addy.

[Sandra]

Thank you very much Wendy, I have just pm'd you.

Sandra