Two cousins - same name grrrrrr

[SussexPat]

I have Eliza Ellen Head b.1861 in Slapton, Devon (my relative) daughter of Richard Head and Ann Thorning.

Her cousin is Eliza Ellen Head b. 1859 Slapton, Devon, daughter of John Head and Elizabeth.

Richard and Ann's daughter is with them, in Slapton in 1861 aged 2 months, can't find her in 1871 and reappears with her grandparents John and Mary Head in 1881.

John and Elizabeth's daughter is with them in 1861/1871 and 1881, sometimes listed as Ellen.
They all lived in Slapton quite closely to each other.

In 1884 one of the Eliza Ellen's married Henry Langley and I've found them on the 1891 and 1901 living in Dartmouth.

The other Eliza Ellen had an illegitimate son Mark Head in 1890, later married Alfred Dawkins and after his death married Thomas Winzer. I've searched and searched for her in 1891 without success although I do have her in 1901 with Thomas Winzer, some winzer children and her children Mark Head and Christina Dawkins.
I've been looking for some kind of clue which would help sort out the two adult Eliza Ellens. I've been contacted by someone on GR who thinks we both have the same Eliza ellen in our families but I'm not convinced. Finding the missing one on 1891 might help.
Any suggestions Please

[HeatherD]

I think you'll need to get one of the marriage certs to sort them out.

[Rachel Scand]

Any idea where Mark was born ?
I looked at births but only found Arthur Mark F Head .... 1890 Kingsbridge .. Devon

and Mark Herbert Head .... 1890 Bedminster .... Somerset/Gloucester

[SussexPat]

Thanks
I realise that would be the simplest answer. However she is a very distant relative of mine so getting a cert for her would be a long way down my priorities. I wouldn't even have looked at her if I hadn't been contacted by someone on GR> My contact has a huge tree for Eliza Ellen who are all my relatives. I'm ok with that, its just that I think she's got the wrong one. She says she isn't able to buy the cert for finacial reasons, which is also a consideration for me. I was just hoping that if I could find the missing eliza on 1891 that would sort it out
Sorry, I've got to go and do the dinner, I'll be back

[SussexPat]

Mark- I've been told he was born in Kingsbridge and that is also the registration dist. for Slapton.

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

I guess you have this one

Neart C is actually Mark on the image and recorded as Kingsbridge birth

RG12; Piece: 1715; Folio 52; Page 2;
Elizabeth Head 58
Emily L Head 18
John Head 62
John L Head 9
Neart C Head 1/12

[SussexPat]

Thanks Glen,

Yes I had seen that one which is why I think my GR contact has got the wrong Eliza Ellen. If Mark was the grandson of John and Elizabeth, then it is their daughter Eliza Ellen who is my contact's relative and NOT the daughter of Richard and Ann as she thinks. The only other possibility is that Mark with John and Elizabeth is the son of another of their children and that Richard and Ann's daughter also had a son Mark. That would mean two Mark Head's born in 1890.

My contact has got a large tree for Ann's relatives (my relatives) and I just feel sorry for her if she has been researching the wrong family.

[Rachel Scand]

I've looked through the births for a Mark Head 1889, 1890, 1891 .... no luck

[SussexPat]

Thanks Rachel.

So do you all think that it would be fair to assume that the Eliza Ellen who was the mother of Mark Head, was therefore the daughter of John and Elizabeth Head? I hope I can convince my GR contact.

I have to go out for an hour or so but if anyone has better luck than me finding the missing Eliza Ellen on 1891 that would be really helpful. My family have been complaining because I've spent so many hours searching for her!

[Glen in Tinsel Knickers]

I think the best thing to do is split the cost of the cert and sort it once and for all.

I have a contact who reckons i have the wrong great grandfather based purely on a census return. My g/f was born 1885, he never appears in the census with his dad as his father died in 1890. His mother remarried to the half brother of her deceased hubby so the surnames all appear correct in 1891 and g/f is quoted as "son". Without the cert i would never suspect but my contact has a serious flaw in his tree.

[SussexPat]

Thanks very much for your help.

I have now found on 1891,a possible Ellen Head, the right age, single, working as a servant in Dittisham. Her place of birth is given as Dittisham but that could be a mistake as its just ditto the person above. I've looked back to 1881 and 1871 and there is no one to match her born in Dittisham. The two villages are fairly close, especially by boat! I know because I visited there just a few months ago.
Anyway there was no helpful information, no Mark Head with her. So I will pass on all the information to my GR contact and let her know that the only way to solve it is with a marriage cert.

[Mary from Italy]

I have an Eliza Inman in Yorkshire who has three first cousins called Elizabeth Inman and one called Betty Inman (who, confusingly, is the sister of one of the Elizabeths). Two of the cousin Elizabeths have the same year of birth, and three of them were born in Bradford.

I also have 7 John Inmans, but not the famous one