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Need help to get on the right track with 'my James'

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  • Need help to get on the right track with 'my James'

    Hello everyone

    I'm wanting to confirm one of my ancestors before I can actually confidently go back further. I have gone back further but obviously, if I'm wrong, the whole thing is wrong.

    Apologies ahead also if I don't write all this down clearly - feel free to ask questions. I'll try and be as clear as I can.

    The ancestor in question is JAMES McKANNA

    To bring him into context as far as I can confirm, my dad Donald McKanna (recently deceased) was the son of Arthur Albert McKanna b 1899 (and Elizabeth Ward) Bethnal Green. He was the son of John Arthur Albert McKanna b1875 (and Mary Ann McCarthy) Mile End Old Town. So John Arthur McKanna was the son of the James in question.

    Initially I had James George Theophilus McKanna as being born 26.5.1845 Mile End New Town, marrying Fanny Godden Francis (b 1843). My mum and dad have got a birth cert for a George Thomas Theophilus with parents being George McKanna and Mary Robinson.
    For my research I assumed this was right I simply stuck the name James on the front of George Thomas Theophilus .Online I have found a baptism for a James McKanna in 1855 but with birth date stated as 18 June 1847. Both birth cert and baptism have parents as George and Mary McKanna.

    I guess I'm asking for help with confirming or disproving that the line I have been researching is the right one.


    Sorry if this all sounds messy, I'm not thinking straight about it any more and have got bogged down in thinking that my research is right - it's very hard to let go of a trail of research - we become strangely attached to people even if they are wrong, don't we??

    Many thanks for any help - feel free to ask questions.

    Amanda

  • #2
    There are these 2 birth regs for 1847 for a McKanna

    McKanna James mothers maiden name Robinson
    GRO Reference: 1847 S Quarter in Whitechapel Union Volume 02 Page 547

    McKanna, James John Mothers maiden name Hughes
    GRO Reference: 1847 S Quarter in Stepney Volume 02 Page 458

    Comment


    • #3
      Although I cannot at the moment see a marriage for Arthur Albert McKanna b 1899 (and Elizabeth Ward) Bethnal Green the line going backwards appears OK. Do you have that marriage cert?

      MCKANNA, ARTHUR ALBERT MMN MCCARTHY
      GRO Reference: 1899 M Quarter in BETHNAL GREEN Volume 01C Page 173

      Census 1901 Bethnal Green, London, England
      John A McKanna 25
      Mary A McKanna 25
      Arthur A McKanna 2

      Marriage 20 Apr 1898 John Arthur Albert McKanna to Mary Ann Amelia McCarthy - St Jude, Bethnal Green Fathers James George McKanna and John Shadrach Mccarthy.


      1881 38 Skidmore St Mile End Old Town
      James Mc Kanna 34
      Frances Mc Kanna 34
      Frances Mc Kanna 12
      Annie Mc Kanna 10
      James Mc Kanna 8
      Arthur Mc Kanna 6
      Sophia Mc Kanna 3
      Edward Mc Kanna
      Edward Mc Kanna 19 brother of James b Plaistow Essex see 1861 census below

      Marriages Mar 1868
      Francis Fanny Godden Mile End 1c 837
      McKanna James Mile End 1c 837


      MCKANNA, ANNIE EMILY mmn Francis
      GRO Reference: 1870 S Quarter in MILE END OLD TOWN Volume 01C Page 502
      MCKANNA, FRANCES ELIZABETH mmn Francis
      GRO Reference: 1868 D Quarter in POPLAR UNION Volume 01C Page 653
      MCKANNA, ARTHUR ALBERT mmn Francis
      GRO Reference: 1875 J Quarter in MILE END OLD TOWN Volume 01C Page 587
      MCKANNA, CHARLES THEOPHILUS mmn Francis
      GRO Reference: 1874 M Quarter in MILE END OLD TOWN Volume 01C Page 570
      MCKANNA, CHARLES THEOPHILUS DEATH age 0
      GRO Reference: 1874 S Quarter in MILE END OLD TOWN Volume 01C Page 370

      1861 census
      Name: James Mc Kannor
      [James McKanna]
      Age: 13
      Estimated birth year: 1848
      Relation: Son
      Father's name: George Mc Kannor
      Mother's name: Mary Mc Kannor
      Gender: Male
      Where born: Spitalfields, Middlesex, England
      Civil Parish: West Ham
      Ecclesiastical parish: Plaistow
      County/Island: Essex
      others:
      George T Mc Kannor 15
      James Mc Kannor 13
      Annie Mc Kannor 3
      Edward H Mc Kannor 4

      NAME: George Mc Kanna
      SPOUSE: Mary Robinson
      MARRIAGE: 3 Jun 1843 - Spitalfields Christ Church,Stepney,London,England

      Looks like the birth for James is as Val posted ie 1847 mmn Robinson
      I haven't put all the census on I am sure you have those but they do follow through quite well.
      So it looks like you are correct but you need those birth and marriage certs that aren't online to be absolutely sure.

      Edit
      Marriages Jun 1843
      McKANNA George Whitechapel 2 479
      ROBINSON Mary Whitechapel 2 479
      Last edited by Katarzyna; 05-03-18, 17:32.
      Kat

      My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

      Comment


      • #4
        wow you have done well Kat I had to go, was going to come back later, but looks like you have the info.

        Comment


        • #5
          Thank you for your help so far.

          It's the James name that is causing me this issue.

          Are there many cases of all the names not appearing on censuses or even marriage certs?

          Running through, if his mum and dad were George McKanna and Mary Robinson, it makes sense that he has Gge as his second name.

          Now - I have a birth certificate of a George Thomas Theophilus McKanna May 1845, parents Gge McKanna and Mary Robinson, Mile End NT.
          I think I've found their marriage entry online, if it's the right George and Mary, it shows Mary's father as being Theophilus Robinson, that could be where the Theophilus link comes in.

          But is my James name actually James George or (James) George Thomas Theophilus - or neither???

          My head is in a spin.....

          AManda

          Comment


          • #6
            Maybe his name is actually just James George, with parents Gge & Mary Robinson......and maybe I've just happened to find a George McKanna married to a Mary Robinson who just happens to have a father called Theophilus and I have just happened to get the wrong cert with the name Gge Ths Theophilus on.....

            Comment


            • #7
              Kat, I think you are right, I have to go with the facts.

              I know my gr grandparents were John Arthur Albert McKanna and Mary Ann Ameila McCarthy. I have their certs and I have photographs with them in, verified by my mum.

              On their mge cert it states that their fathers are John Shadrach McCarthy an James George McKanna.

              I think this Theophilus name link may be a a red herring. I probably need to really check the parents as being George McKanna and Mary Robinson...

              What do you think?

              Apologies for the messy thread..

              Comment


              • #8
                we think the James McKanna born 1847 in Whitechapel is yours,
                and this is the marriage
                James McKanna
                Gender: Male
                Marriage Age: 22
                Record Type: Marriage
                Birth Date: abt 1846
                Marriage Date: 25 Jan 1868
                Marriage Place: St Philip, Stepney, Tower Hamlets, England
                Father: George McKanna
                Spouse: Fanny Godden Francis
                Register Type: Parish Register

                Comment


                • #9
                  and this is the George marriage a different Frances bride

                  George Thomas Theophilus McKanna
                  Gender: Male
                  Record Type: Marriage
                  Marriage Date: 2 Dec 1867
                  Marriage Place: St John of Jerusalem, South Hackney, Hackney, England
                  Father: George McKanna
                  Spouse: Fanny Carter
                  Register Type: Parish Register

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Yes, looking at it all, I think you are both correct.

                    My one is James Gge (married Fanny Francis) with father George and mother Mary Robinson.

                    Thank you so much for helping me sort this clearly, sometimes you can get into such a muddle.

                    Thanks

                    Amanda x

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      I've ordered the birth cert for James born 1847 Whitechapel to confirm other details.

                      Thanks again.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        here is James's and his Sister Elizabeth's Baptisms.James and Elizabeth McKanna Baps.JPG

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Yes, I've got those, thanks Val x

                          Amanda

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            I expect I'll have to make the trek to Ireland at some point to visit the old homestead, Monaghan, and research the parish records over there at some point for the McKannas'

                            The earliest I have gone back, but need some of the really early proof is James McKanna born 1781.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              The thing that is bothering me is the birth of John Arthur Albert McKanna.
                              It is not until his marriage in 1898 and the following censuses plus his Army records that he is known as John A A McKanna. Before that, his birth registration and 1881 and 1891 censuses have him as just Arthur Albert.
                              Kat

                              My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Also the irish parish records are online for free on the national library of iteland website and on findmypast. Ancestry has them too, but you need a subscription.

                                Also, you're unlikely to find catholic irish records prior to 1800, usually only protestant records survive from that period.

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Yes, Kat, I've been thinking this all along. I was wondering if because his dad was James George, he was known as John as a shortform of James, and so the family could tell the difference between Arthur Albert senior and junior...?

                                  We had a similar issue for a while wondering why my other grandad started calling himself Arthur Hamilton which was his mum's surname, instead of Tullett, his actual surname.

                                  BTW, I got James McKanna's birth cert today, it confirms George as his father and Mary Robinson as his mother.

                                  Amanda

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