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census challange, only a road name

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  • census challange, only a road name

    I have a house in a street called Swete Street in Plaistow London.
    Parish West Ham.

    c1860 it is a large house on the street (only building showing on the map)
    After 1869, Swete Street starts getting its Victorian terraced houses built along it

    I do know that in the 1970's my friend (surname suckling) lived there and that it was of a construction far older than the Victorian Terraced houses either side of it.
    her number was number 59 and it was created by the splitting of the large building that had been on its own on the 1860 map into two separate dwellings (nos. 57 and 59).

    What I'm trying to find out is what was the purpose of the original building (a farm perhaps?)
    And can it be found on the early census' (1841, 51, 61), to give any clues to its original purpose?

    Plus any census results for number 30 Swete Street (my childhood house), which was built around 1890 ish

    Many thanks
    Trev
    Last edited by TrevorFranklin; 10-09-16, 01:16.
    Avatar is my Gt Grandfather

    Researching:
    FRANKLIN (Harrow/Pinner 1700 to 1850); PURSGLOVE (ALL Southern counties of England); POOLE (Tetbury/Malmesbury and surrounding areas of Gloucestershire and Wiltshire (1650 to 1900); READ London/Suffolk

  • #2
    1901- RG13
    Piece number1574
    Folio 70
    Page 63

    30, Swete Street, West Ham, Essex, England

    Geo Scott Head Married Male 44 1857 Grocer Shopkeeper Loughton, Essex, England
    Eliza Scott Wife Married Female 40 1861 - St George in the East, Middlesex, England
    Alice Scott Daughter Single Female 17 1884 - Ratcliff, Middlesex, England
    Polly Scott Daughter Single Female 14 1887 - Forest Gate, Essex,
    Kat

    My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

    Comment


    • #3
      1911 RG14
      Registration district West Ham
      Registration district number 188
      Enumeration district 21

      Alfred Cooke Head Married Male Grocer And C 54 1857 Gilmorton Leatonshire
      Emily Jane Cooke Wife Married Female Assisting In The Business 56 1855 Sunning Hill Berks
      Kat

      My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

      Comment


      • #4
        1939
        Ref: RG101/1033B/005/26

        George J Pierson 22 Dec 1915 Male Gen Labourer Engineer Shop Gen Stores-Heavy Worker Married 49 1
        Brian George Pierson 24 Dec 1937 Male Under School Age Single 49 3
        Herbert H Green 28 Sep 1909 Male Dock & Riverside Worker,Hea Wo Single 49 4
        Charlotte E Green 16 Sep 1913 Female Unpaid Domestic Duties Married 49 5
        Kat

        My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

        Comment


        • #5
          1891 was listed as No 26 Swete street
          RG12
          Piece number 1325
          Folio 109
          Page 23
          George Scott Head Married Male 34 1857 Tea Cooper And General Shop Keeper Loughton, Essex, England Transcription
          Eliza Scott Wife Married Female 30 1861 Attends W Shop St Georges, Middlesex, England Transcription
          Eliza Scott - - Female 9 1882 Scholar Mile End, Middlesex, England Transcription
          Alice M Scott - - Female 7 1884 Scholar Ratcliff, Middlesex, England Transcription
          Polly Scott - - Female 4 1887 Scholar Forest Gate, Essex, England Transcription
          Ada Major Sister In Law Single Female 17 1874 Wifes Assistant Bethnal Green, Middlesex, England Transcription
          Kat

          My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

          Comment


          • #6
            Many thanks Kat,

            Your records cover my old house (30 Swete Street), it was indeed an old corner shop (right on the corner with Stock Street)the changing face of Swete Street.JPG, but when I lived there, we used the shop section as the biggest kids play area you could need :-)

            After looking at you saying it was number 23, I looked on the old-Maps website ( www.old-maps.co.uk), and I have seen why , it was not actually built until after then, I thought the whole section was the same age and so have learnt something.

            Now just the extremely hard question of no's 57/59
            The map of 1869 has it entirely on its own, but when the street is built up over the next few decades, it is not demolished, but split into two and included in the layout.
            It no longer stands, as that whole section was bulldozed and rebuilt in the 1990's, which means I have no current owner to ask for views of deeds etc :-(.

            We are trying to put together a background of the places we were brought up in and my friend's father was also a well know F1 series Stock Car racer, who kept his cars there in the 60's / 80's.

            Trev
            Avatar is my Gt Grandfather

            Researching:
            FRANKLIN (Harrow/Pinner 1700 to 1850); PURSGLOVE (ALL Southern counties of England); POOLE (Tetbury/Malmesbury and surrounding areas of Gloucestershire and Wiltshire (1650 to 1900); READ London/Suffolk

            Comment


            • #7
              I have saved the images
              57 on 1911 RG14PN9431 RG78PN507A RD188 SD3 ED21 SN75
              6 rooms
              Eliza Thomas Head Married Female - 41 1870 Stepney London Transcription
              William Thomas Son - Male - 12 1899 Clapton London Transcription
              Elise Thomas Daughter - Female - 10 1901 Clapton London Transcription
              Harold Thomas Son - Male - 9 1902 Clapton London Transcription
              Victor Thomas Son - Male - 7 1904 Clapton London Transcription
              Ethel Thomas Daughter - Female - 4 1907 Plaistow Essex Transcription
              Sidney Thomas Son - Male - 2 1909 Plaistow Essex Transcription
              Richard Lloyd Brother Married Male Compositor Printing 43 1868 Stepney London E Transcription
              Edith Lloyd Sister Single Female Machinist Dressing Gowns 32 1879 Bow London Transcription
              Maria Cook Boarder Widow Female - 80 1831

              59 on 1911
              RG14PN9431 RG78PN507A RD188 SD3 ED21 SN76
              5 rooms

              Frederick Rich Head Married Male Copper Smith 38 1873 Southampton Hants Transcription
              Grace Rich Wife Married Female - 35 1876 Old Ford Middlesex Transcription
              Frederick Rich Son - Male - 9 1902 Plaistow Essex Transcription
              Hilda Rich Daughter - Female - 7 1904 Plaistow Essex Transcription
              Cyril Rich Son - Male - 4 1907 Custom House Essex Transcription
              Olive Rich Daughter - Female - 1 1910 Custom House Essex
              Kat

              My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

              Comment


              • #8
                no 57 in 1901

                Joseph E Quicke Head Married Male 44 1857 Engine Draughtsman Devonport, Devon, England
                Emily L Quicke Wife Married Female 44 1857 - Pimlico, Middlesex, England
                Joseph H Quicke Son Single Male 21 1880 Engine Draughtsman Kentish Town, Middlesex, England
                Ethel E Quicke Daughter Single Female 19 1882 - Kentish Town, Middlesex, England
                John E Quicke Son Single Male 18 1883 Engine Fitter Kentish Town, Middlesex, England
                Herbert J Quicke Son Single Male 16 1885 Commercial Clerk Peckham, Surrey, England
                Charles S Quicke Son Single Male 14 1887 - Staffordshire, England
                Alfred E Quicke Son - Male 12 1889 - Poplar, Middlesex, England
                Matilda M Quicke Daughter - Female 10 1891 - Poplar, Middlesex, England
                George F Quicke Son - Male 9 1892 - Plaistow, Essex, England
                Charlotte E Quicke Daughter - Female 7 1894 - Plaistow, Essex, England
                Walter J Quicke Son - Male 5 1896 - Plaistow, Essex, England
                Kat

                My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

                Comment


                • #9
                  57 swete st.

                  1891 gap between 31 and 63
                  no 63 and 65 are the last two.
                  no 63 has two families - 12 people so a larger house?

                  1881
                  cannot find the street

                  1871 RG10/1633/14 just nos 1 and 2
                  Kat

                  My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    57 swete st.

                    1891 gap between 31 and 63
                    no 63 and 65 are the last two.
                    no 63 has two families - 12 people so a larger house?

                    1881
                    cannot find the street

                    1871 RG10/1633/14 just nos 1 and 2

                    1861 cannot find the street. This is TNA street list for West Ham and Swete is not there

                    This Page is [ARCHIVED CONTENT] and shows what the site page http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.uk/index.php?title=Place:West_Ham_Registration_District,_1861_Census_Street_Index_S-T looked like on 31 Dec 1900 at 23:59:59


                    And for 1851

                    This Page is [ARCHIVED CONTENT] and shows what the site page http://yourarchives.nationalarchives.gov.uk/index.php?title=Place:West_Ham_Registration_District,_1851_Census_Street_Index_P-S looked like on 31 Dec 1900 at 23:59:59


                    There isn't a list for 1881

                    have emailed you
                    Last edited by Katarzyna; 10-09-16, 21:19.
                    Kat

                    My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Thanks Kat,

                      the 1871 census will be the building I was looking for, as, when you look at the 1869 map, they were the only building on that street.
                      The only 'map' I can find prior to that is a basic map (via old-maps.com), for 1850, which shows for the Hamlet of Plaistow, in the parish of West Ham, a lane coming off the High Street in the position between the words 'high' and 'street' that would be Swete Street on the 1869 map.
                      The main roads in Plaistow at that time being Balaam Street and Howards Road.
                      Chesterton Road, where you have the Chesterton Crescent identified on the 1871 census that you sent me, was another lane above Howards Road,(above the word Plaistow on the 1850 map), that connected to Swete Street.

                      So it looks like they will be on the 1851 and 1861 census somewhere in the hamlet of Plaistow, Parish of West Ham, but the roads are lanes that are not yet named, making it virtually impossible to find them.

                      I wonder why a large section of Swete street was not enumerated on the 1891 census, another puzzle for the "I'll do it later" shoebox

                      As for the street being missing on the 1881, why?

                      Many thanks for the effort you have put in for me, but it looks like it may be a trip to the London met archives someday.

                      TrevPlaistow Hamlet 1850.JPG
                      Avatar is my Gt Grandfather

                      Researching:
                      FRANKLIN (Harrow/Pinner 1700 to 1850); PURSGLOVE (ALL Southern counties of England); POOLE (Tetbury/Malmesbury and surrounding areas of Gloucestershire and Wiltshire (1650 to 1900); READ London/Suffolk

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Have found them on 1881.
                        It says 1 & 2 are unoccupied ???

                        1&2 Swete Street.JPG

                        It was a challenge Swete Street was not listed on enumerators sheet at the beginning.


                        Have sent image.
                        Last edited by Katarzyna; 11-09-16, 01:04.
                        Kat

                        My avatar is my mother 1921 - 2012

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Many thanks Kat.

                          Swete Street seems to have been a strange location for houses, with sections not being enumerated etc.
                          Even my Victorian house/grocer's shop on its corner was built about 5 years after the main terraced section it was connected to.

                          What I can say about the building that, is 1/2 on the 1871 census, was unlike all the others in the street, it was larger, it did have brick chimney stacks (2), but in parts, the actual walls were made of slates of wood and horsehair
                          Which means it was most probably an early building that was partially remodeled in the early 1860's.
                          It's just a shame I could not find out more via a census search, but that's what local archives are there for.

                          We did it before this Internet thing came along :-)

                          Trev
                          Avatar is my Gt Grandfather

                          Researching:
                          FRANKLIN (Harrow/Pinner 1700 to 1850); PURSGLOVE (ALL Southern counties of England); POOLE (Tetbury/Malmesbury and surrounding areas of Gloucestershire and Wiltshire (1650 to 1900); READ London/Suffolk

                          Comment

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