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  • Charles Gardner/Gardniner/Gardener

    I am trying to locate my great grandfather Charles Gardner who I am assuming was born around 1880 to 1890.

    i only have a photograph of him taken in the Navy. this photo I have is over 100 years old as I do know that his best friend Charles Albert Birks who is also on the photograph died in the Battle of Jutland in 1916. However my family have told me that Charles Gardner did visit our home town of Hull to speak to Birks wife after his death. Assuming this is right this would mean that he either was not in the Battle of Jutland or simply was a survivor.

    i am also told that he was from London, again I am unable to confirm or deny this. All of my research has provided me with lots of Charles Gardners and unfortunately I do not know which one it is.

    my one last hope is that someone will recognise him from my photo.

    So if anyone has a Charles Gardner born around 1880 to 1890 from the London area who was in the Royal Navy Or know he had connections to Hull I would greatly appreciate it if they would contact me and I would forward the photo. ( I am unsure if I can post this photo on this thread)

    waiting ith hope, Tracey

  • #2
    Tracey, you can post the photo on the thread. However, the section of the forum where you originally posted is for people to post research requests, e.g. requests for photos of churches, headstones, houses etc.
    I am going to move your thread over to our Family History Research secton to see if anyone can help.

    Do you have the marriage certificate for your greatgrandfather as this would help determine his age and should also give the name and occupation of his father, which might help locate them in the 1891-1911 censuses?
    Elaine







    Comment


    • #3

      Comment


      • #4
        Your image in post #3 is not showing up for me. I can see that you have tried to link it to a photobucket image so have redone the link. Is this the right one?


        Elaine







        Comment


        • #5
          Elaine

          yes it is the correct one, thank you so much for your help.

          tracey

          Comment


          • #6
            Tracey, could you please give us as many details about him as you can?

            Do you know when he died?
            Who was his wife?
            Names of any of/all his children?
            Any other useful information.
            Elizabeth
            Research Interests:
            England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
            Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

            Comment


            • #7
              Tracey,

              do you have anything that might help pinpoint your gt grandfather at all? for example do you have your grandparents' marriage cert [or a copy of it] if not could you get one, this would help greatly in trying to determine, where/who were related and possible areas to begin looking. [also any witness's to the marriage could help] as they could be family members. Do you know if your gt grandfather had any siblings? if so do you know their names?
              Julie
              They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

              .......I find dead people

              Comment


              • #8
                snap Elizabeth :smilee:
                Julie
                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                .......I find dead people

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Darksecretz View Post
                  snap Elizabeth :smilee:
                  I was hoping he might be alive in 1939. If we could find him we would get a date of birth.
                  Also, marriage details would be very useful.
                  Elizabeth
                  Research Interests:
                  England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                  Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Thanking you for all your help and suggestions! However I am at a loss as I only have a name and cannot confirm anything else. Surprisingly there are many Charles Gardner's in the Royal Navy around those years.

                    i cannot get any certificates as I need to start by establishing exactly who he is. I am hoping someone may recognise him from the photo.

                    tracey

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Chaney999 View Post
                      I am trying to locate my great grandfather Charles Gardner who I am assuming was born around 1880 to 1890.
                      Who is your grandfather/grandmother, the child of Charles Gardner?
                      When was he/she born?

                      I would imagine you know at least this much!
                      Elizabeth
                      Research Interests:
                      England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                      Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Chaney999 View Post
                        Thanking you for all your help and suggestions! However I am at a loss as I only have a name and cannot confirm anything else. Surprisingly there are many Charles Gardner's in the Royal Navy around those years.

                        i cannot get any certificates as I need to start by establishing exactly who he is. I am hoping someone may recognise him from the photo.

                        tracey
                        We always have to work backwards, Tracey, so the more we know about your grandparent who was his son/daughter the better.
                        Elizabeth
                        Research Interests:
                        England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                        Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          My grandmother is Ruth Ann Birks, born in Hull in 1918 , but she was born out of wedlock and therefore Charles Gardner is not registered as her father... This is the difficulty I have?


                          The story goes that his best friend was Charles Albert Birks born 1895 in hull. Both were in the navy and Charles Birks was killed in the Battle of Jutland 1916. Subsequently Charles Gardner visited his wife and began a relationship with her resulting in my grandmother. My grandmother told us that he was a cockney! From this I can only assume he is from down south as anything South of Hull to us is 'cockney'!

                          hope that makes sense

                          tracey

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Tracey, I now see your predicament. I have a similar problem in my own tree, and in our case we think we never will be able to identify the girl's father, so I'm pleased you at least have a name.

                            It's going to be very difficult as we won't find Charles Gardner with your grandmother or her family.

                            On FMP they have this collection:
                            British Royal Navy & Royal Marines, Battle Of Jutland 1916 Servicemen

                            There are these men:


                            First name(s) Charles
                            Last name Gardiner
                            Birth year 1897
                            Birth date 21 Apr 1897
                            Birth town Finsbury
                            Birth county London
                            Birth country England
                            Service number K27190
                            Rank -
                            Ship name Inflexible
                            Archive The National Archives
                            Piece number 921
                            Series ADM 188
                            Archive reference ADM 188/921/27190
                            Record set British Royal Navy & Royal Marines, Battle of Jutland 1916 servicemen



                            First name(s) Charles
                            Last name Gardner
                            Birth year 1893
                            Birth date 26 Jul 1893
                            Birth town -
                            Service number 16143
                            Enrolment date 18-Oct-11
                            Rank -
                            Ship name Birkenhead
                            Division Royal Marine Light Infantry: Portsmouth Division
                            Archive The National Archives
                            Piece number 189
                            Series ADM 159
                            Archive reference ADM 159/189/16143
                            Record set British Royal Navy & Royal Marines, Battle of Jutland 1916 servicemen



                            First name(s) Charles William
                            Last name Gardener
                            Birth year 1890
                            Birth date 09 Aug 1890
                            Birth town South Shields
                            Birth county Durham
                            Birth country England
                            Service number M13676
                            Rank -
                            Ship name Agincourt
                            Archive The National Archives
                            Piece number 1045
                            Series ADM 188
                            Archive reference ADM 188/1045/13676
                            Record set British Royal Navy & Royal Marines, Battle of Jutland 1916 servicemen
                            The first one is the only Londoner.
                            Last edited by Elizabeth Herts; 14-06-16, 09:24.
                            Elizabeth
                            Research Interests:
                            England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                            Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Here is Charles Albert Birks:

                              First name(s) Charles Albert
                              Last name Birks
                              Birth year 1894
                              Birth date 08 Apr 1894
                              Birth town Hull
                              Birth county Yorkshire
                              Birth country England
                              Service number SS114538
                              Rank -
                              Ship name Queen Mary
                              Archive The National Archives
                              Piece number 1120
                              Series ADM 188
                              Archive reference ADM 188/1120/114538
                              Record set British Royal Navy & Royal Marines, Battle of Jutland 1916 servicemen
                              Elizabeth
                              Research Interests:
                              England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                              Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Charles Albert Birks did not serve on the same ships as Charles Gardiner from Finsbury.
                                It doesn't necessarily mean they didn't know each other, though.
                                Elizabeth
                                Research Interests:
                                England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                                Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  Charles William Gardner from South Shields served on Victory II, as did Charles Albert Birks.
                                  Elizabeth
                                  Research Interests:
                                  England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                                  Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    The other Charles Gardener didn't serve on the same ships as Charles Albert Birks.
                                    Elizabeth
                                    Research Interests:
                                    England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                                    Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Chaney999 View Post
                                      My grandmother is Ruth Ann Birks, born in Hull in 1918 , but she was born out of wedlock and therefore Charles Gardner is not registered as her father... This is the difficulty I have?


                                      The story goes that his best friend was Charles Albert Birks born 1895 in hull. Both were in the navy and Charles Birks was killed in the Battle of Jutland 1916. Subsequently Charles Gardner visited his wife and began a relationship with her resulting in my grandmother. My grandmother told us that he was a cockney! From this I can only assume he is from down south as anything South of Hull to us is 'cockney'!

                                      hope that makes sense

                                      tracey
                                      Here is some information on Charles Albert Birks:
                                      First name(s) Charles Albert
                                      Last name Birks
                                      Birth year 1894
                                      Birth day 8
                                      Birth month Apr
                                      Birth town Hull
                                      Birth county Yorkshire
                                      Death year 1916
                                      Death date 31/05/1916
                                      Service number S.S.114538. (Po.)
                                      Rating Sto. 1st.
                                      Service R.N.
                                      Ship/unit Hms Queen Mary
                                      Cause of death Killed or died as a direct result of enemy action.
                                      Cemetery Body not recovered for burial
                                      Location of grave Not recorded
                                      Relatives notified Wife. Ruth. 34, Parnsley St, Holderness Rd, Hull.
                                      Category Military, armed forces & conflict
                                      Subcategory First World War
                                      Collections from Great Britain
                                      Elizabeth
                                      Research Interests:
                                      England:Purkis, Stilwell, Quintrell, White (Surrey - Guildford), Jeffcoat, Bond, Alexander, Lamb, Newton (Lincolnshire, Stalybridge, London)
                                      Scotland:Richardson (Banffshire), Wishart (Kincardineshire), Johnston (Kincardineshire)

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        The Charles William Gardener born 9-8-1890 in South Shields (1939 Register) appears to have married in South Shields in Jan/March 1921 to Esther Grant born 21-6-1903. They appear to have had four children in South Shields (2 boys and 2 girls). He was a ships Carpenter and died in South Shields in June 1962. No sign of any London connection to him and his parents William and Anne E both born in South Shields too.
                                        This is him in 1911 - mother now a widower -

                                        Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

                                        Comment

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