Helen Reid nee Clements - Death.

[RJD7227]

Helen Clements was born 1809 in London. She married a Charles Samuel Reid in 1835 and the last census record for her is 1851. I am seeking her death. Her husband is living with a Charlotte in 1871 and who he married later. the marriage certificate states he is a widower but did he commit bigamy.

[Janet in Yorkshire]

To narrow down the time span, have you found the husband in 1861?

Jay

[JBee]

There's several Helen Reid deaths.

Dec 1851 - Kensington
Dec 1862 - Hampstead

Helen Reed
Dec 1858 - Kensington

Also Helen Reid

In 1874 in Chelsea - age out though says 80 but could be her if someone didn't know her age.

Have you looked for her in the 1871 census - they could have parted - she too could have re-married or living as though she was married to someone else.

Then again not sure if the 7 year rule applied then - regarding presumption of death!!!

[RJD7227]

I am unsure as to your question. The last known trace of Helen is in the census for 1851 living at 136a Union Street, Southwark, St. Saviour, London, the census states Ellen but it is Helen. Her husband Charles in the 1861 census records him as living with a Charlotte Reid (wife) This is Charlotte Snow nee Wreford and they are not legally married. They actually marry on 28 February 1881 (I have marriage record) and both are listed as being widowed. In 1891 they are living at No 340 Camberwell New Road, Lambeth, London. Has Charles committed bigamy? Charles died 1898 at No 340 Camberwell New Raoad , he committed suicide and this is recorded in the Lloyds newspaper 27 February 1898.
There are a lot of Helen Reid's deaths recorded but none match the missing Helen.

[RJD7227]

The actual spelling is Reid. The last trace known is 1851 for Helen, the census states Ellen but it is Helen residing at 136a Union Street, Southwark, London. In 1861 Charles is recorded as having a wife called Charlotte, they are not married and she is actually Charlotte Snow nee Wreford. They actually married on 28 February 1881 and the marriage record shows both are widowed. In 1891 they are living at No. 340 Camberwell New Road, Lambeth, London. Charles died 1989 he committed suicide. There are a lot of Helen Reid's death recorded but none match Helen.

[AntonyM]

The fact they married after apparently 20 years together makes bigamy less likely - it usually tends to suggest they were waiting for a former partner to die and so be free to remarry. But of course you can't be sure until you track down the death(s), or divorces, for the former partners. Maybe it was the death of Charlotte's former husband that triggered the wedding.

There is an Ellen REED death (age 65) in St Saviours, Southwark RD in 1877 , and there is also another in the same name (age 84) in 1893 - they may be worth investigating.

[Uncle John]

You need to be a bit flexible about spellings. Other people wouldn't necessarily know how a person spelt their name, and even the person concerned might be unsure.

[Guest]

Could this be her illegitimate child?
James Thomas Clements -Upjohn
Born 1832
Baptism year 9 Mar 1832
St Nicholas Chiswick
Middlesex
Mother's name
Helen Clements
Father's name
James Thos.Upjohn
Notes (Father from Hammersmith ) illegitimate

[Guest]

what about this death Helen Reid Dec 1851 Kensington London 3 246

[vera2013]

Wondered about this one. Could fit with Anthony M's post 6 for death in Shoreditch 1877

http://interactive.ancestry.co.uk/7619/LNDRG10_609_612-0445/5335100?backurl=http%3a%2f%2fsearch.ancestry.co.uk%2f%2fcgi-bin%2fsse.dll%3findiv%3d1%26db%3duki1871%26gss%3dangs-d%26new%3d1%26rank%3d1%26gsfn%3dfrederick%2bhenry%26gsln%3dG*ll*tt%26msbdy%3d1858%26msypn__ftp%3dMiddlesex%252c%2bEngland%26msypn%3d5275%26msypn_PInfo%3d7-%257c0%257c0%257c3257%257c3251%257c0%257c0%257c0%257c5275%257c0%257c0%257c%26_83004003-n_xcl%3df%26MSAV%3d1%26uidh%3d326%26pcat%3dCEN_1870%26fh%3d16%26h%3d5335100%26recoff%3d%26ml_rpos%3d17&ssrc=&backlabel=ReturnRecord

Ellen Reid Mother Married aged 60 Tailoress born Hammersmith
Thomas Gullatt Married aged 33 Police Constable born Devon
Mary Gullatt Married aged ? 31 born Middlesex
Frederick aged 12 born Middlesex

Living St Mary, Newington


Seem to recall this from another time/forum. Ancestry have Ellen Reid transcribed with the family above but I would say she was living in the same house as the Gullatt's. Did wonder if the Mary Gullatt was Ellen's daughter Mary Ann b 1844.

It is possible that the child Frederick is the child of Thomas only I suppose as in 1911 he gives his pob as Devon. Can't seem to make that one fit with a marriage for Thomas and Mary though.

Vera

[vera2013]

https://www.deceasedonline.com/servlet/GSDOSearch

There is an Ellen Reed buried at Nunhead Cemetery 13th July 1877. London Boro of Southwark.
Its pay to view to see more info.

Vera

[RJD7227]

Hello Vera. Have looked at thi on at great length and I am certain it is not but will go over it again.
Thank you for responding. Reg.

[Guest]

are you dismissing my info

[RJD7227]

helen Reid

what about this death Helen Reid Dec 1851 Kensington London 3 246

HI Val. Have investigated this one and it is not Helen Thank you for responding. I have now one possible and will have to order a death certificate.
Regards. Reg

[RJD7227]

Thank you Vera. Will have a look at this one and thank you. Reg.

[RJD7227]

Dear Val. I never dismiss anything. Apologies if I have caused any offence. Reg.

[RJD7227]

Dear Val. I never dusmiss anything. My apologies if I have offended you. Reg.

[Guest]

just thought as it was at the end of that page you may have missed it, which death are you going for the 1877 one ??if so wonder where she is in 1861 and 1871 then

[Guest]

Found the burial for Helen Reid in 1851 Kensington and your right its not her found the address she was at in 1851 she is actually a Lady born in Scotland.

[Guest]

Helen Reid 1877 Burial Southwark, had a few credits so looked this one up too she is aged 65 so a possibility