Witnessing a Marriage in 1887

[Kaye LaLa]

Hi all - just a very quick question.... How old would an individual have to be in order to witness a marriage in 1887?

I have a Lady getting married and the witness has the same surname as her - I was wondering if it could be her daughter, but if a witness needed to be 18 then it couldn't be. I'm searching for children of this Lady and they're proving to be very elusive, as is she!

Any advice would be brilliant.

Many thanks

[AntonyM]

There is no age requirement for a marriage witness, certainly not now (so I would assume not then either).

The registrar has to be satisfied they are old enough to understand what is going on and what they are being asked to witness, and to testify as to what they have seen and heard if that became necessary.

[Kaye LaLa]

Thank you for that

I can now search for the witness as possibly a daughter - see if it sheds anymore light on the mess lol

Thanks again

[AntonyM]

Daughter, mother, cousin, aunt, sister in law ?

Lots of possibilities.

[Kaye LaLa]

It's all a bit strange lol A relative of mine has the Marriage Cert and says the witness is down as Ellenor Baker, but I found reference to it in an old newspaper and the name Eleanor Clarke! I've had no joy looking for Ellenor Baker, so I think it's time to try another route - it was just a speculation anyway.

Thanks again

[AntonyM]

Newspapers often get things wrong, and if the certificate came from GRO, that is not really a primary source either. To be certain of what it says you need to get a certificate taken from the original register entry, ideally produced by photocopying it. Even then it depends on whether the signature is readable, or just a squiggle.

Current practice is for the registrar at the wedding to ask the couple and their witnesses to tell them exactly what their signatures say, and this is then pencilled into the register margin next to the entry so it can be reproduced accurately on any certificates produced later.

[Kaye LaLa]

I'm not sure where the certificate came from? Apparently though my relative seems to think that the Registrar wrote the whole thing - which I thought was normal practice? It was 1887 and I suspect both parties were pretty illiterate. I've seen so many things mistranscribed and been led on wild goose chases, that I'm a little more careful now lol

[JudithM]

I'm not sure where the certificate came from? Apparently though my relative seems to think that the Registrar wrote the whole thing - which I thought was normal practice? It was 1887 and I suspect both parties were pretty illiterate. I've seen so many things mistranscribed and been led on wild goose chases, that I'm a little more careful now lol

The bridegroom and witnesses should have signed the registers (or made a mark if they couldn't write) but the vicar, or registrar, usually then writes out the certificate and I would say did so then as well as I have my grandparents original certificate and it is all in the vicar's handwriting, whilst I have seen their signatures in the register .

[AntonyM]

The bridegroom and witnesses should have signed the registers (or made a mark if they couldn't write) but the vicar, or registrar, usually then writes out the certificate and I would say did so then as well as I have my grandparents original certificate and it is all in the vicar's handwriting, whilst I have seen their signatures in the register .

That is the correct process, although I have seen quite a few vicars who write out the certificates along with the register and then invite the couple and witnesses to sign them all. I've just checked my own marriage certificate and that definitely has my signature on it (and in biro too !) Registrars tend to stick more closely to the rules than vicars do...

[Anne in Carlisle]

Its my signature on our marriage certificate cos I made a small mistake, which is there for evermore!
Anne

[Olde Crone Holden]

I've told this many times before but here it is again!

I have three certificates for the marriage of one set of 2 x GGPs.

1. A photocopy of the entry in the church register
2. A photocopy of the entry sent to the local RO
3. A modern (1980s) GRO copy written by the clerk in 1980s.

All three have differing information on them! Church copy gives their declared ages, the two register office copies say "full" for age. The names of their fathers have been transposed on (3) and their addresses change from South Street (1) to Smith Street (2) - very annoying because BOTH streets existed at the time they married. Luckily for me I knew the names of their fathrs before I sent for any certificate, but my 3rd cousin who didn't know, spent years trying to track them down with the "correct" parents.

I'm sure my experience is the exception but I'll bet it's not unique!

OC

[JudithM]

My experience is not so extreme but of the three copies I have of my grandparents marriage, nan is listed as Lillie in the register, also Lillie on the certificate given to her at the time, but the vicar seems to have started to write Lily then changed the y into an l. On the copy of the entry in the register sent to the GRO her name has changed to Lilian