Help needed

[Jurapow]

I'm really new to this site and already am asking for help.

I have traced the married transciption of my grandmother and grandfather and notice that the name of the bride's father and the name of the groom's father are the same.

Now, Do you think this is a mistake in the typing, or have I stumbled upon a skeleton in the cupboard.

Was my grandmother an adopted child perhaps, or perhaps she was a (as my mother would have said) a 'Took to' child, unofficially adopted and brought up in the family and then, when she
grew up, my grandfather and she were married.

This is a real mystery as I can't find my grandmother's birth record either, only her name on a survey as living with my grandfather after they were married.

Any ideas as to what I can do, or any help offered will be very much appreciated.

Julia

[Guest]

if they are not alive you can put the details on here and somebody will help

[margaretmarch]

I'm really new to this site and already am asking for help.

I have traced the married transciption of my grandmother and grandfather and notice that the name of the bride's father and the name of the groom's father are the same.

Now, Do you think this is a mistake in the typing, or have I stumbled upon a skeleton in the cupboard.

Was my grandmother an adopted child perhaps, or perhaps she was a (as my mother would have said) a 'Took to' child, unofficially adopted and brought up in the family and then, when she
grew up, my grandfather and she were married.

This is a real mystery as I can't find my grandmother's birth record either, only her name on a survey as living with my grandfather after they were married.

Any ideas as to what I can do, or any help offered will be very much appreciated.

Julia

They may have been cousins from sons of brothers who happened to be named the same. It happened a lot that names were repeated in families.

You need to investigate wider on the family and putting by their names and any other details you have on here we can help.

Margaret

[Olde Crone Holden]

Where have you found a transcription of the marriage?

OC

[Jurapow]

Thanks for your replies. I found the transcript of the marriage on Findmypast. That is the only site I have used so far.

The marriage on 2nd March 1896 was between John Burgess DOB 1870 and Emily Vaughan, who's age was given at the time of the marriage to be 23, which would make her DOB 1873 approx. On a census form, Emily was born in Pembrokeshire.
They were married in the parish of Trevethin Monmouthshire Wales. As I have stated, the bride's name and the groom's name were both shown as Joseph Burgess, which is John Burgess's father.

Your help is very much appreciated.

Julia

[Elizabeth Herts]

I have viewed the entry on FMP and unfortunately there is no image.

I would be inclined to think it is a mis-transcription as Emily's surname was Vaughan and I couldn't find a prior marriage for an Emily Burgess.

I couldn't find an appropriate baptism in either Pembrokeshire or Monmouth for Emily, using both surnames.
However, I found the following, which is worth bearing in mind:

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbprs%2fwal%2f004394426%2f00730&parentid=gbprs%2fb%2f914409351%2f1

EMILY VAUGHAN
Born 17 Sep 1871
Baptised 15 Oct 1871
Baptism day 15
TREVETHIN
Mother's first name(s) Jane
Father's first name(s) William
County Monmouthshire
Country Wales
Page 636

[Olde Crone Holden]

As it is a transcription of a transcription (!) I would imagine it is simply a clerical error somewhre along the line. I have a cert in my possession where the fathers of the bride and groom have been transposed. A look at the original parish register showed the fathers the correct way round although I already knew what had happened.

You could buy a copy of the marriage cert from the local Register Office, or you could hunt down the church records to find out what was originally said.

OC

[Elaine]

The marriage is on freereg

County Monmouthshire
Place Trevethin
Church Parish Church
Marriage Date 02 Mar 1896
Groom Forename John
Groom Surname BURGESS OTP
Groom Age 26
Groom Condition Bachelor
Groom Occupation Collier
Bride Forename Emily
Bride Surname VAUGHAN OTP
Bride Age 23 Spinster
Groom Father Joseph BURGESS
Groom Father Occupation Collier
Bride Father William VAUGHAN
Bride Father Occupation Publican
Witnesses William VAUGHAN Susannah CAWAN

[Olde Crone Holden]

Oh, well done Elaine. Mystery solved!

OC

[Elaine]

Really must use freereg more than I do, it was just a chance look

[Elizabeth Herts]

Could this be Emily in 1891:

Mill Road, Trevethin
Laban Vaughan Head Single 26 Inkeeper Born Pontypool
Emily Vaughan Sister Single 19 Born Pontypool
Series RG12
Piece number 4361
Folio number 15
Page 24

[Elizabeth Herts]

So this one in 1871:

10, Mill Road, Trevethin with Pontypool, Monmouthshire
William Vaughan Head Married Male 50 Fireman At Tin Works Panteg
Jane Vaughan Wife Married Female 46 - Usk, Monmouthshire
Laban Vaughan Son Single Male 16 Catcher At Rolls Tin Works Pontypool, Monmouthshire
William Vaughan Son Single Male 11 Scholar Pontypool, Monmouthshire
Emily Vaughan Daughter Single Female 9 Scholar Pontypool, Monmouthshire
Elijah Gould Or Goned Lodger Single Male 55 General Labourer Pontypool, Monmouthshire
Owen Evans Lodger Widower Male 33 Tailor Carmarthen, Carmarthenshire, Wales
William Evans Lodger Single Male 7 Scholar Panteg

[Elizabeth Herts]

Sorry - that should be 1881.

[Elizabeth Herts]

1871
William is a railway guard aged 40 with Jane (wife) and children Alice J (12), Laban (6) and William (1).

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbc%2f1871%2f0021719105&highlights=%22%22

[Elizabeth Herts]

In 1881 William Vaughan is stated as being born in Panteg (Panteague), so this could be him with his family before he married:

1861 Census
Blaendare, Panteague, Pontypool
William Vaughan Head Married Male 59 Labourer At Iron Work Panteague, Monmouthshire
Martha Vaughan Wife Married Female 54 - Panteague, Monmouthshire
William Vaughan Son Unmarried Male 28 Labourer At Iron Work Panteague, Monmouthshire
George Vaughan Son Unmarried Male 18 Labourer At Iron Work Panteague, Monmouthshire

http://search.findmypast.co.uk/record?id=gbc%2f1861%2f0020237681&highlights=%22%22

[Elizabeth Herts]

Returning to Emily, if you wanted to order her birth certificate these are the details:

First name(s) EMILY
Last name VAUGHAN
Birth year 1871
Birth quarter 4
Registration month -
Mother's last name -
District PONTYPOOL
County Monmouthshire
Country Wales
Volume 11A
Page 133
Record set England & Wales births 1837-2006
Category Birth, Marriage, Death & Parish Records
Record collection Births & baptisms
Collections from Great Britain

I note from the father's details on the marriage that he is given as a Publican. The only similar occupation I could find was for Laban, her brother, who was an Innkeeper.

[Jurapow]

I'm very sorry if I caused a confusion. The last sentence should read - the bride' father's name and the groom's father's name were both shown as Joseph Burgess, which was the groom's father.

[Jurapow]

Thank you all so very much for your help especially Elizabeth. I think you have hit on the right one and I will do a lot more research.
I also realise that I need to explore other sites as well as findmypast.
Can anyone recommend which is the best?

Julia

[Elizabeth Herts]

First piece of advice, Julia, is to buy all the certificates you can afford for your direct ancestors, then work backwards.
I have gone back quite a way, but please don't assume it is correct until you have purchased the relevant certificates and have proved to your satisfaction they are the correct people.

Family Search is free, and I found this on there:

https://familysearch.org/pal:/MM9.1.1/FQL1-7NB

Non-conformist records are a minefield, and Wales, of course, had many chapel-goers, so bear this in mind.

Please post any more queries you may have. We do like a challenge!

[margaretmarch]

Thank you all so very much for your help especially Elizabeth. I think you have hit on the right one and I will do a lot more research.
I also realise that I need to explore other sites as well as findmypast.
Can anyone recommend which is the best?

Julia

Another subscription site that many of us on here use in www.ancestry.co.uk who have many of the same records as FMP but also some different records.
Please do post your queries on here if you wish and we will be pleased to help.
Margaret