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  • Searching for a man!

    The man I am interested in is Phillip Bamford born 1841/42 in Wortley near Sheffield. In 1892 he married Ann Hubbard of Derby. You can find him on the 1881/91 and1901 censuses (or is it censi? I'm not sure?
    !)
    It is his life from birth to his appearance on the 1881 census I am interested in, since the rest of it is eay to follow but I can't find anything before 1881. I have sent for his marriage cert to Ann and that will give more information. I will post details when it arrives.
    in the meantime I hope the forum has more luck than me in unearthing information about him.

    Kev

  • #2
    Was he married twice, and to two ladies called Ann, or have you put the wrong year for the marriage?



    This 1871 census return seems to fit with the Hubbard connection & the 1891 occupation. I realise pob is "out."

    Jay
    Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 15-05-14, 12:45.
    Janet in Yorkshire



    Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

    Comment


    • #3
      ETA - So, are we saying it was a rather late marriage, which took place in 1892? 20+ years after co-habiting and several children? Seems like there could be a story to unravel!

      Jay
      Janet in Yorkshire



      Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

      Comment


      • #4
        Originally posted by Janet in Yorkshire View Post
        ETA - So, are we saying it was a rather late marriage, which took place in 1892? 20+ years after co-habiting and several children? Seems like there could be a story to unravel!

        Jay
        it's looking like that Jay, I found that 1892 marriage to Ann Hubbard and the hubbard family are the family that he is with in 1871, i'll dig out the census refs and post them on this thread.
        Julie
        They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

        .......I find dead people

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by Janet in Yorkshire View Post
          ETA - So, are we saying it was a rather late marriage, which took place in 1892? 20+ years after co-habiting and several children? Seems like there could be a story to unravel!

          Jay
          It's very possible that Philip was married at the time he was cohabiting with Ann though there is no evidence so far.

          A mystery to unravel? My family history is full of them!�� see " searching for a woman"

          Comment


          • #6
            1841: http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...try&h=12633860
            Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 1325; Book: 16; Civil Parish: Tankersley; County: Yorkshire; Enumeration District: 4; Folio: 7; Page: 6; Line: 23; GSU roll: 464275.


            1851: can't find yet!


            1861:http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=4
            Source Citation: Class: RG 9; Piece: 2545; Folio: 39; Page: 38; GSU roll: 542987.


            1871: http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=4
            Source Citation: Class: RG10; Piece: 3572; Folio: 38; Page: 34; GSU roll: 839770.
            this has POB as BURTON derbyshire where on the image it states BUXTON, Derbyshire.

            1881: http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=2
            Source Citation: Class: RG11; Piece: 4664; Folio: 117; Page: 34; GSU roll: 1342128.

            1891:http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=1
            Source Citation: Class: RG12; Piece: 3836; Folio: 60; Page: 17; GSU Roll: 6098946.

            1901:http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=3
            Source Citation: Class: RG13; Piece: 4398; Folio: 142; Page: 49.

            I think its possible that Philip was known by another name before 1871 and possibly married too, and he changes his name and begins a new life with Ann Hubbard.
            Last edited by Darksecretz; 16-05-14, 16:26. Reason: adding other census!!
            Julie
            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

            .......I find dead people

            Comment


            • #7
              afternoon Kev :smilee:
              Julie
              They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

              .......I find dead people

              Comment


              • #8
                Whoa! What are we saying here? Which name did he change? Christian name, surname or both? This could have tremendous implications!

                Comment


                • #9
                  I have a birth cert for one of Philip's children, Edwin Bamford (my great grand father). He was born 9th July 1886 to Philip Bamford and Ann Bamford formerly Hubbard at 276 Alfred Road, Sheffield. Philip's job is given as a labourer in a boiler works.
                  It would seem that Ann was calling herself Bamford before she married Philip.

                  Perhaps this information is of some use?

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Sometimes a name change happening in adulthood is a result of illegitimacy, mother marrying, child being known as XXX (step-father's surname) then reverting to birth name.

                    But as yet, I haven't found a relevant birth reg for Philip, although not uncommon in 1841.
                    Also, I'm not having much luck searching for a Philip born c1841 in Wortley. :(

                    Jay
                    Janet in Yorkshire



                    Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Thetallone View Post
                      I have a birth cert for one of Philip's children, Edwin Bamford (my great grand father). He was born 9th July 1886 to Philip Bamford and Ann Bamford formerly Hubbard at 276 Alfred Road, Sheffield. Philip's job is given as a labourer in a boiler works.
                      It would seem that Ann was calling herself Bamford before she married Philip.

                      Perhaps this information is of some use?
                      IF Philips mum and dad were not married they may have baptised/registered him as Philip s/o Isaac Bamford and Mary Brown [for example] so he could be known as Philip Brown before the 1871 census which may be why we are having such a hard time finding him.

                      I guess as Wortley is the next step, do you know where the parish records for Wortley are?? Sheffield Archives? [maybe a local studies library]?
                      Julie
                      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                      .......I find dead people

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Janet in Yorkshire View Post
                        Sometimes a name change happening in adulthood is a result of illegitimacy, mother marrying, child being known as XXX (step-father's surname) then reverting to birth name.

                        But as yet, I haven't found a relevant birth reg for Philip, although not uncommon in 1841.
                        Also, I'm not having much luck searching for a Philip born c1841 in Wortley. :(

                        Jay
                        I never found a Phillip Bamford in Wortley either. I have contacted Thugoland Parish register people. Wortley forms a part of Thurgoland. The man I contacted was not particularly helpful and new little of family history research.

                        Perhaps if Phillip was unhappily married possibly with children then he may have adopted the name Phillip Bamford if he knew someone of that name,about his age but had died early. With a completely new name, his life in Derby with Ann would have been more secure.
                        Did he know Ann before he turns up in Derby, and did he change his name completely, move to Derby then meet Ann?

                        The mind boggles!

                        Kev

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          LOOK AT THIS!

                          sometimes writing it all down gives you ideas!

                          1861: http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=4
                          Source Citation: Class: RG 9; Piece: 2545; Folio: 39; Page: 38; GSU roll: 542987.

                          he is in Buxton for this census, BUT, gives his POB as Wortley, Yorkshire [his occupation is Blacksmith]

                          Philip D. Donald

                          I will have a look now to see if I can find him in 1851 etc.. now :smilee:

                          I meant to ask Kev do you subscribe to Ancestry or FMP at all.. not much good me keep posting links if you can't see them.. [though it does help the others that are searching!]
                          Julie
                          They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                          .......I find dead people

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            GOT IT!

                            1841: http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...&rhSource=8912
                            Source Citation: Class: HO107; Piece: 1325; Book: 16; Civil Parish: Tankersley; County: Yorkshire; Enumeration District: 4; Folio: 7; Page: 6; Line: 23; GSU roll: 464275.

                            Philip DOLAN aged 1 living with Hannah BAMFORD aged 60

                            that is the connection I'll bet she was his grandma!
                            Julie
                            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                            .......I find dead people

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              there are two registrations for this birth, same vol/page number but slightly different names. I guess one was in error:

                              Name: Philip Dolana
                              Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1840
                              Registration district: Wortley
                              Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
                              Volume: 22
                              Page: 734


                              Name: Philip Doland
                              Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1840
                              Registration district: Wortley
                              Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
                              Volume: 22
                              Page: 734
                              Julie
                              They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                              .......I find dead people

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                that birth reg may be a red herring, I have found this but not sure whether it would be right or not.

                                Name: Philip Dolan
                                Gender: Male
                                Baptism Date: 30 Aug 1840
                                Baptism Place: Wortley By Penistone,York,England
                                Father: Peter Dolan
                                Mother: Louisa
                                FHL Film Number: 919371



                                having had a quick google I have found that this is very near to Thurgoland.
                                Last edited by Darksecretz; 15-05-14, 14:48.
                                Julie
                                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                .......I find dead people

                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  This must be irrelevant, but here it is anyway!

                                  Phillip Dolan = Bridget O'Connell, Hunslet 1871.

                                  OC

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Darksecretz View Post
                                    that birth reg may be a red herring, I have found this but not sure whether it would be right or not.

                                    Name: Philip Dolan
                                    Gender: Male
                                    Baptism Date: 30 Aug 1840
                                    Baptism Place: Wortley By Penistone,York,England
                                    Father: Peter Dolan
                                    Mother: Louisa
                                    FHL Film Number: 919371



                                    having had a quick google I have found that this is very near to Thurgoland.
                                    Are you suggesting that Philip was the illegitimate son of Philip Dolan and Louisa (Bamford?). That Louisa then lived with her mother,Hannah Bamford and at some point Philip took the name Bamford instead of Dolan?

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Originally posted by Darksecretz View Post
                                      LOOK AT THIS!

                                      sometimes writing it all down gives you ideas!

                                      1861: http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin...iv=1&ml_rpos=4
                                      Source Citation: Class: RG 9; Piece: 2545; Folio: 39; Page: 38; GSU roll: 542987.

                                      he is in Buxton for this census, BUT, gives his POB as Wortley, Yorkshire [his occupation is Blacksmith]

                                      Philip D. Donald

                                      I will have a look now to see if I can find him in 1851 etc.. now :smilee:

                                      I meant to ask Kev do you subscribe to Ancestry or FMP at all.. not much good me keep posting links if you can't see them.. [though it does help the others that are searching!]
                                      I do subscribe to Ancestry but I've never heard of FMP. What is it?
                                      kev

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        I might be way out here but there is a Peter Dolan marrying in 1843

                                        Name: Peter Dolan
                                        Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1843
                                        Registration district: Sheffield
                                        Inferred County: Yorkshire West Riding
                                        Volume Number: 22
                                        Page Number: 431

                                        and there is a Peter Dolan living in around Sheffield in the census, he was b. 1810 ireland

                                        this is purely guesswork though and we do need to be looking for Peter/Louisa's marriage [and see if she was a Bamford] and also if this is peter that marries in 1843 what happened to Louisa?
                                        Julie
                                        They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                        .......I find dead people

                                        Comment

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