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Dorothy Ada Knight - where did she go?

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  • Dorothy Ada Knight - where did she go?

    Dorothy is my step aunt (the half sister of my Dad, my grandmother having remarried). Dorothy was born January 1915 in St Pancras, London. My grandmother Clara Ellen Knight, previously Dyer and her maiden name was Woods died in July 1918, and Dorothy's father Henry Colin Knight died in 1919. What I want to know is what happened to Dorothy after her parent's died

    What I do know is that Dorothy was somehow or other taken under the wing of a spinster member of the WD & HO wills family with the surname of Douglas-Hamilton and she went to boarding scheme called Frensham Heights in Surrey. Interestingly the school's founder was called Edith Douglas-Hamilton but she, I believe married into the family. I know that Dorothy married and have been in contact with her daughter, many years ago, who told me of the connection with the Douglas-Hamilton family and I understand that Dorothy continued to receive financial support until her death in 1996. Her daughter had no other previous information regarding her early years.

    At the time of my grandmother's death my dad had two younger brothers, both dead now the youngest being born in 1910 so would also have been 8 years old and I have no idea what happened to him after the death of his mother. My father at that time would have been 18 years old and again died many years ago

    So .....what I am trying to find out is who looked after Dorothy and my Uncle who would not be able to look after themselves. Frensham Heights have been very helpful and provided some photographs from 1925/1926 when Dorothy would have been 16 years old but do not appear to have any records that can provide any other information.

    Any advice, suggestions as to how I could find out what happened to her and my Uncle during those earlys would be very much appreciated. Dorothy had been my brick walls for years and regularly comes out for further investigations. Can I break it down this time with your help?

    I hope,this does not ramble too much but wanted to provide as much information as I could
    Thank you

  • #2
    There does not appear to be any birth in the UK for a girl named Edith Douglas - Hamilton but there was a girl named Edith Annie Wills/Edith Annie Hamilton Wills who married Percy Seymour Douglas - Hamilton in Sept. 1901 at St George Hanover Sq., 1a 1014. Edith was the eldest daughter of Sir Frederick Wills, Bt., Tobacco Manufacturer of Bristol, of 9 Kensington Palace Gardens, Manor Heath, Bournemouth, & Northmoor, Dulverton, Somerset. She may have been the first wife of Percy and if so, maybe she hinted at a spinster status. When Edith died in 1927, she left £1,755,795 with many charitable bequests included and one of her Executors was a Juliette Carlier.
    When a ?Henriette Carlier died in 1949, her Will showed she left around £6000, but included £20 each to 12 'formerly' adopted children of the late Mrs Edith Hamilton Douglas - Hamilton plus a signet ring, given to her by Mrs D - H, to one of them and small pieces of jewellery to each of the others.
    It is surprising what may be found in old newspapers and there are quite a few references to Percy Seymour D - H and Edith, but maybe your Dorothy was one of the 12 'formerly' adopted children of Mrs D - H.

    merleyone

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    • #3
      Of no help to you whatsoever, but my immediate thought is sponsorship through boarding school by a member of the extended family and then being "sent out to the colonies" in the late 20's.
      I have no logical reason for this hypothesis, other than having read about similar scenarios for other orphaned boys.

      Jay
      Janet in Yorkshire



      Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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      • #4
        Thank you Meryleyone I had come up with the possibility of Edith Ann Wills as being the "adopter" especially as she was the founder of the school Frensham Heights. My understanding is that Dorothy received a "payment" for the Douglas - Hamilton right up until she died. Which papers did you obtain this information regarding the Will and the beneficiaries from please? My understanding is that the adoption would not have been formal as this did not come into place until 1927 I think but perhaps it was an informal adoption. Also the mystery of my Uncle, the half brother of Dorothy as to where

        Janet at least I know that she married in the 1940s and became a respectable GPs wife, and so I know she was not sent to the colonies.

        Thank you to both.

        Comment


        • #5
          Sorry, Gill, I didn't make myself clear. I meant the missing brother having been sent to the colonies!

          Jay
          Janet in Yorkshire



          Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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          • #6
            Janet I see, I hadn't thought of that although in my mind I think he was a soldier in WW11 although I haven't found any records. I need to research him a bit more. Thank you

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            • #7
              This might be of help

              Clara Ellen Woods married David Dyer in Dec 1899 Windsor

              Clara Ellen Dyer married Henry C Knight in May 1914 Pancras.

              Haven't found her on either the 1901 census or 1911.

              Thought it might help if we could find the boys in 1911

              Clara dies in 1918 aged 42 so born about 1876
              Lin

              Searching Lowe, Everitt, Hurt and Dunns in Nottingham

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              • #8
                Hi Lin. Yes I have this information. In the 1901 she is at her with her parents in Surrey together with my father, frederick. In 1911 she is showing as Ellen Dyer with two of her sons Edward john and Alfred Ernest. My father is missing but I think I found him on a census in Sussex at a children's holiday home. I think this was possibly respite care as his father David had just died in 1910.

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                • #9
                  Is it Edward John or Alfred Ernest you are wanting to know about or both?
                  Lin

                  Searching Lowe, Everitt, Hurt and Dunns in Nottingham

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                  • #10
                    Meryleyone. I have just found the newspaper article you mention and Dorothy's name is mentioned as a beneficiary. I wonder why this lady left this money to her!

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Gill D View Post
                      In 1911 she is showing as Ellen Dyer with two of her sons Edward john and Alfred Ernest. My father is missing but I think I found him on a census in Sussex at a children's holiday home. I think this was possibly respite care as his father David had just died in 1910.
                      Don't you mean Arthur Ernest Gill? I assume this is the one you are trying to find out about?
                      Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

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                      • #12
                        Hi chrissie. Yes that is correct Alfred Ernest is my missing man from his mother died.

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                        • #13
                          So far, through process of elimination (cross checking Alfred E Dyer births), the most likely death for him looks to be in 1965 but that was in Cheshire. I have been trying to tie that up with a marriage and the wife dying same area but no luck so far.
                          Chrissie passed away in January 2020.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Hi Gill,

                            I've just come in and seen your post, so sorry I had not given you the newspaper details. I fact I had not seen the one you found. I saw the Gloucester Citizen of 18/11/1949 re Henriette Carlier, which did not give the names of the twelve children. I have now seen the one you found, did you notice that Christopher Knight is also named as one of the twelve? There were several reports in 1927 of Mrs Edith Douglas - Hamilton's Will including the Dundee Courier of 8/10/1927 and one I made a note of to do with her pending marriage was the Evening telegraph of 28/6/1901. The really relevant ones deal are those which cover the children.
                            I have only seen one census entry for a Juliette Carlier, who is shown as a Lady's Maid aged 34 in 1901, b. France, at Barn Ridge, South Nutfield, Reigate, although whose household she is in is unclear. In 1949, Henriette J Carlier died aged 86 but I have not found any census entry for her, maybe Juliette and Henriette J are one and the same, or possibly sisters. There is also no death registration for Juliette who was one of three reported executors, with Edith's brother and her bank manager, which must be indicative of the trust placed in her by Edith, who also left her was a small annuity.

                            All food for thought, but no solutions readily apparent.

                            merleyone

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                            • #15
                              Hi Meryleone. I hadn't noticed the Christopher knight but as far as I am aware he is not related!!!!

                              I really would like to know how she was "adopted" by this family. Formal adoption was legal until 1927 I think and would like to find out who looked after Dorothy when her mother died. Interestingly her father when he died left nearly £200 to a male friend who was his best man and married I think to hIs sister and would have imagined that perhaps they would have taken her in but have no way to find that out. Sorry a bit of a ramble, she is in my thoughts so much.

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                Hi chrissie. I had found this same man and believe that Alfred married Eliza Waller in 1933 ish I really need to get the death certificate I think to see who the informant was

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                                • #17
                                  The probate calendar entry for Henriette Carlier says "CARLIER Henriette otherwise Henriette Juliette otherwise Juliette of 51 Swan Court Chelsea....." so it looks like its the same person
                                  Jackie

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                                  • #18
                                    Gill D., I think I can help. Dorothy Knight, born 11/1/15, was at St Christopher School, Letchworth, before Frensham Heights. Mrs Douglas-Hamilton was also a benefactor of St Christopher before 1925, and had a house nearby. Dorothy Knight's aunt, a Mrs F. R. [possibly P - the script is not very clear] Poynter, is given as her guardian at the time.

                                    If you would care to message me here or, better, email the contact address on the website of the old scholars' club of St Christopher (www.oldscholars.info) I can give you more information. (Club secretary.)

                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Hi Ostch. Thank you for the information you have provided and I have e mailed you via the school website as you suggested.

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