George Foster/Forster b 1791 - d 1828 - help to find long searched for baptism

[Sue1]

George Foster/Forster b 1791 (birth year calculated from dod which was 6 April 1828 age 37 at Loachbrook - buried Astbury St. Mary) was probably/possibly born in Loachbrook/Lochbrook/Loachbrock (spelt variously) which is on the Sandbach/Sommerford Road - the actual address is Spragg Street, Whetstones Edge, Loachbrook, Astbury, Cheshire. The church used by other members of the family was Astbury St. Mary. It is, of course, possible he was not born there. His father should be called William - how he will have spelt his surname is another thing - it was extremely variable i.e. Forrester/Forester/Foster/Forster. He himself was married as Foster and died as Forster.

I have been trying to go further back for some years and this chap is my brickwall on this side of the family.

He married Jane Bebington/Bebbington on 1 July 1816 (have original copy of this) at Prestbury Church, Cheshire. They had 4 children all baptised at Astbury St. Mary. Family Search shows this marriage and states they were both living in Saltersford-cum-Kettleshulme, Cheshire. Original entry shows they were both living at North Rode which comes under the Chaplaincy of Prestbury. The witnesses are not helpful as far as I can tell. He was an agricultural labourer and may have worked, possibly, at Rode Hall but this is speculation, not fact. He was married by Banns and parents names are not on entry.

I suspect his dob is somewhere around 1791 but possibly earlier if his age at death was incorrect. I have no idea if he had any siblings but almost certainly did. Up until now, this line of the family starts with William and alternates with George all the way back to this George. I have always "assumed" (a bad thing to do in genealogy) that this George's father will be a William.

I am pretty sure he will have been born in the Somerford/Astbury area. His wife, Jane, was born in Somerford and baptised at Astbury St. Mary in 1797.

I am sorry if this sounds muddled but I am muddled - I just wondered if anyone could find his baptism for me - it would give his parents (I do have a couple possibilities but no proof without his baptism)

Sue

[Felix]

These are the only two possibles I could find:

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/record?recordid=gbprs%2fb%2f771259208%2f1&confirmed=1

http://www.genesreunited.co.uk/record?recordid=gbprs%2fb%2f741391299%2f1&confirmed=1

First Name GEORGE
Last Name FORSTER
County Cheshire
Year 1789
Mother's Given Name Elisabeth
Mother's Last Name Forster
Father's First Name John
First Names George
Father's Last Name Forster
Birth Year 1789
Birth Date
Age
Parish St. Peter
Place CONGLETON
Christening Date 13 Dec 1789
Christening Year 1789
City Or Town Congleton
Location St Peter, Congleton

First Name GEORGE
Last Name FORSTER
County Cheshire
Year 1792
Mother's Given Name Alice
Mother's Last Name Vernon
Father's First Name Isaac
First Names George
Father's Last Name Forster
Birth Year 1792
Birth Date
Age
Parish
Place TARPORLEY
Christening Date 13 May 1792
Christening Year 1792
City Or Town Tarporley
Location Tarporley

[Bertie]

Have you considered / eliminated this one (west of Astbury)?



Name George Forster
Event Type Christening
Event Date 13 May 1792
Event Place Tarporley, Cheshire, England
Gender Male
Age
Marital Status
Father's Name Isaac Forster
Mother's Name Alice Vernon
Spouse's Name
Spouse's Marital Status
Spouse's Father's Name
Spouse's Mother's Name
GS Film number 1751853
Digital Folder Number 004011895

[Sue1]

Hi Felix,

I am not a member of GR now so cannot view these they tell me.

Sue

[Felix]

Sorry ;)

Just edited the post with the info.

[Sue1]

Bertie,

Many thanks for that - I think this is an entirely separate family although perhaps this far back they no longer are.
I followed the lower end of this family you mention when I first started researching and then realised I was following the wrong line. I am curious about the name Vernon though because I was told fairly recently that Martha VERNON b 1826 of Siddington, Gawsworth, Prestbury married Joseph Forster bap Feb 1825 Astbury, son of George b 1791. The marriage to Martha Vernon took place at Astbury St. Mary. This doesn't sound like the same Vernons however (although it was a second marriage for Martha Vernon who had been married to a Joseph Bowers). I have no real provenance for this only what I was told - I know they had children, the firstborn of this marriage was 1851/2ish. Martha's parents also came from Siddington. I really don't think my lot come from the Nantwich side of Cheshire, more the Congleton/Astbury side (Northwich side I think it is called) but there are always exceptions to the rule.

I had found two that "fitted" but with no parents for George could not prove it. The ones I found were: Possible father of George c1791: William FORESTER b April 1769 (or 71 - don't know why I made this note re dob) Sandbach, Cheshire. Baptised Astbury. FSOrg Film: 1941901, dig.folder: 4018701. His father is William (no mum's name)
William was a Silk Throwster. They actually lived in Sandbach. I have the original baptismal entry for this but

a) probably not allowed to put on line and
b) probably couldn't do it anyway.

There is possibly more family in Bradwall (this is within Sandbach) but as far as I can see the next birth is the same month or not long after and same year and it is the birth of a Hannah FORSTER to a William Forster of Bradwall b 28.4.1769.

Sue

[Sue1]

Thank you for that Felix. The first one sounds extremely interesting - seems odd they got the child baptised in St. Peters Congleton (that is a first) although it is very close (perhaps Astbury was being rebuilt or they just didn't like the vicar!)
Elizabeth is the mother of this George - one of George jnrs children was called Elizabeth - he didn't use John for his son. Probably doesn't mean anything but they always seemed to observe some kind of protocol in naming their children.
I don't honestly think the second one could be mine.

You have given me food for serious though.

Sue

[Sue1]

Oh dear. I was so sure George Forster bap 13.12.1789 at Congleton St. Peter was going to be THE ONE.
He died on 5.2.1790 sadly.

Sue

[clematised]

https://familysearch.org/search/record/results#count=20&query=%2Bsurname%3Aforster~%20%2Bfilm_number%3A1941901

This link to Familysearch gives all the name variations of Forest/Forster and so on from 1600 onwards 137 results at Sandbach Cheshire I have browsed through but thought you ay like to look yourself.

Edna

[Sue1]

Many thanks indeed for that Edna.

There aren't too many who had a child called George sadly.
In retrospect I should have mentioned that the Fosters variously spelt their name, usually Forster this far back and later, after a George b 1844 once and for all changed to Foster. It is also possible they could, this far back, be Forrester or Forester possibly because of accents and/or illiteracy.
George Forster who was supposedly born in 1791 (should be Astbury really I think because they didn't move far in those days but they did live on the Sandbach Road). He, I notice, not on the page you have quoted, has recently appeared among "births/deaths/marriages" - this was not on before and the death is known to be 1828 (which I hope is correct) and his marriage is correct - I have the original entry - I think FSOrg may have done what I did i.e. calculate the dob from the age given at death. If he wasn't sure when he was born he may well have had his age wrong. He married in 1816:

1. Marriage to Jane Bebbington1816 1 Jul Prestbury St Peter, Cheshire, England - BOTH PARTNERS LIVED IN NORTH RODE, CHESHIRE - A VILLAGE NEAR ASTBURY AND OTHERS - I have the original entry for this. After marriage first child born in Astbury St. Mary. All four children were baptised there.
2. 1828 6 Apr Loachbrook, Cheshire, England
burial date (Astbury Church) Image 225/Dig GS no. 4011828/film no 1647809 [place named as Lochbrook - this is LOACHBROOK on the Somerford/Chapel Holmes Road near Astbury.] BURIED IN THE NAME OF FORSTER - age 37.

The actual place of residence for George b 1791ish was Loachbrook, Whetstones Edge, Astbury - this is where he died. His death date is correct - someone sent me the BTs.

The reason I started looking in Sandbach/Bradwall is because I couldn't find a contender in Astbury and it is so close!

Sue

[Arilla]

Sue, you've probably already searched it but if not you could try searching for baptisms in the various surname spellings on the online Cheshire Parish register database CPRdb. Not the easiest database to navigate but always worth a look as it allows you to search transcribed records for the whole county.
Good luck!

Sandra

[Sue1]

Hi Sandra,

Yes, I know that database and have searched it BUT it was not complete - don't think Astbury was on there but might well be by now - it has been some time since I looked at it - will revisit. Thanks for reminding me about it.

Sue

Have just had a look at Cheshire Parish Records Database and Astbury, Congleton and Sandbach are not on there. Prestbury is not on there either, which is where the marriage took place.

[kylejustin]

findmypast has a good collecetion of cheshire parish registers, with images.

[Darksecretz]

Sue,

have you had a look at the old Hugh Wallis Batch number site? this has now been revamped, but the principle is still the same and you don't have to specify a surname, you can 'browse' by place....

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~hughwallis/IGIBatchNumbers/CountyCheshire.htm

if you click on Astbury P009771 it will bring up another page, don't fill anything in, just 'submit'.. it will bring up ALL names in that area.. [helps with spelling variations as well!]

[Sue1]

Kylejustin

I have had a good "go" at FMP and not found anything that I can be reasonably sure of even after a recent try. Am no longer a member as of a few weeks ago.
I have, however, kept a couple of images that I thought may prove to be relevant but at the moment I don't think they are.

Julie

I have certainly used the Hugh Wallis Batch no. site in the past but not recently and I had no idea it had been re-vamped ................I shall give the site a serious look-at - probably today as going on hols tomorrow.

Thanks to both of you.

Sue

[SmallTownGirl]

Is there anything here of use ...

http://www.dustydocs.com/county/5/cheshire.html?country_id=1#A

[Sue1]

Thank you very much for that link - have not heard of it before. George is proving horrendously stubborn! Sadly no real luck - again it does show George's dob as 1791 but NO PLACE (this is a fairly recent addition and as I said above somewhere, it was probably calculated from his age at death, which was 37 when he was buried on 6.4.1828 at Astbury St. Mary). He married Jane Bebbington d/o Samuel Bebbington and Betty Dean at Prestbury Church. Both were resident in North Rode at the time of marriage. George was a Labourer and signed X, Jane signed. I have the original marriage entry and other than saying George's occupation there is no extra useful info on there.
After marriage they must have moved/gone back to Astbury because their first child William FoRster was baptised there is 1817 as were Elizabeth 1821, Ellen 1823 and Joseph 1825. William the oldest, is my direct line and I have full details on him and his descendants down to myself.
I am sure George must be from that area (unless he crossed the border from Staffordshire - I have checked and found no-one who "fits the bill". It is impossible to go back further with any certainty without knowing who George Foster/Forster/Forrester/Forester's parents were.
I may have to call it a day for the time being with this line but it may be worth ordering "further details" from FSOrg who sometimes have more info than they have put on the documents online - have not yet quite worked out how to do this.
[At some point on FSOrg it shows George as living in Saltersford-cum-Kettleshulme at the time of his marriage (not in the records I have just seen) - his marriage cert says North Rode. I now know that North Rode is within Saltersford-cum-Kettleshulme - at least I am told it is.]

Sue

[SmallTownGirl]

... but it may be worth ordering "further details" from FSOrg who sometimes have more info than they have put on the documents online - have not yet quite worked out how to do this.

Here's the link to ordering copies of documents from FS ...

https://familysearch.org/blog/en/policy-change-patrons-requesting-photocopies-family-history-library-salt-lake-city-utah/

[Sue1]

Thank you very much for the FSOrg link.

Sue

[Kirsty]

Hi Sue1,

Not sure if you'll still be following this thread but am hoping so.

I just entered "Loachbrook George Forster" into Google and it brought me here.

I have a puzzling mention of a George Forster in relation to my family tree and am wondering if the George Forster in question is your George Forster.

Here's my story (I'll try and not get too confusing but please bear with me).

I have an ancestor in my tree by the name of Mary ROBINSON nee FORSTER. Mary was born in Somerford Booths c. 1811 (going off age recorded with burial) or c. 1812 going off age recorded on the 1851 & 1861 censuses. I have an Astbury, St. Mary baptism which looks like my Mary;

10 May 1812
Mary daughter of Margaret FORSTER, Somerford Booths.

NOTE: I believe the scan of the above baptism was taken from the Bishops Transcripts. I've yet to view (or confirm I've viewed) a scan/micro film of the Astbury Parish Register and there may be a discrepancy between the BT and PR.

I have Margaret FORSTER (Mary's mum) on the 1841 census living next-door but one to her married daughter, Mary ROBINSON in Newsbank, Somerford Booths.

The next time I find Margaret FORSTER is her death / burial.

Died 28th April 1847 - Buried 2nd May 1847 Astbury, St. Mary.

The burial entry reads; Margaret Forster - Somerford Booths - Age 70 years.

The death certificate records the place of death and the resident of informant to be Congleton but I very much believe this to be a reference to the district rather than the actual place of death or the actual residence of the informant. The informant was Margaret's son-in-law and next-door but one neighbour, Peter ROBINSON (Peter ROBINSON and family lived in Somerford Booths). NOW THIS IS WHERE IT GETS WEIRD. In column 5 of the death cert., Margaret's occupation is recorded as "Widow of George Forster Labourer".

As no father was recorded with Mary FORSTER's baptism and I've never found her a sibling it looked like Mary was an illegitimate child (and I wasn't holding my breath on the finding the father front). However, seeing Margaret FORSTER's death certificate has made me re-examine what I thought I knew. Was Margaret really married to a George FORSTER? If so, why isn't he mentioned with Mary's baptism. Also, I haven't found a strong suggestion for a marriage between a George FORSTER and a Margaret. And if Margaret WASN'T ever really married to a George FORSTER then why does her death certificate say she was the widow of one?

The ONLY George FORSTER in the area, that I can find, who is old enough to have fathered Mary is the George FORSTER who died as a resident of Loachbrook in 1828 (he would have been around 20 / 21 at the time of Mary's birth).

Did George FORSTER c. 1791 - 1828 father Mary FORSTER c. 1812?

I'd just love to hear anyone's views and/or opinions on this one. It's got my head spinning.

Kind regards, Kirsty