Australian Death Records

[Jules]

Could anyone with worldwide on Ancestry let me know what information would be on a record for Agnes Mabel Davies in who died in Australia in 1976. Such a sad story, It seems that her two sons were taken from her and sent to Australia as Barnardo children. Gustave was sent when he was only 10 in 1932 and his brother Charles in 1934. Gustave was killed in Singapore in 1942. Agnes left the U.K. in 1948 to (i hope) join Charles.
Thanks for any information.

[Debbss]

I havePM you what it says,

[caddie51]

Hello Julie,
Agnes Mabel DAVIES who died at NUMURKAH, VICTORIA first shows on the 1936 NUMURKAH electoral; she was Agnes Mabel CAMPBELL married Earl Thomas DAVIES, 1929 VICTORIA.
Agnes Mabel DAVIES nee RAPSON appears to have died 1974 in NEW SOUTH WALES.
Charles Alan DAVIES died 1991.
Will PM you details.

[Jules]

Thanks Caddie51

I am sorry to mess you around and you have been put to so much trouble, but it seems that this is the wrong Agnes Davies, unless she is telling porkies. I will have to go back and have another check for her. Gustave and Charles were definitely sent to Australia, because Gustave died in 1942 in Singapore while serving in the Army.
Just looked at the other information that you sent, that is amazing thank you so much for that.

[Christine in Herts]

Thanks Caddie51

I am sorry to mess you around and you have been put to so much trouble, but it seems that this is the wrong Agnes Davies, unless she is telling porkies. I will have to go back and have another check for her. Gustave and Charles were definitely sent to Australia, because Gustave died in 1942 in Singapore while serving in the Army.
Just looked at the other information that you sent, that is amazing thank you so much for that.

Do bear in mind that people didn't always tell the truth if it suited them better to give a different impression.

You mention that "Gustave died in 1942 in Singapore while serving in the Army." The Australian National Archives database includes Gustave - and gives his DoB. Such a late record doesn't give access to any images (yet) but there is a link which would allow you to request a copy. Perhaps you have that already? 'C DAVIES' is named as NoK.

There are two records for 'Agnes Mabel DAVIES' under the immigration and naturalisation records. There's one for 1948, which includes her DoB, and one for 1951 - possibly her naturalisation document.

Christine

[caddie51]

Hello Jules,
Agnes Mabel DAVIES nee RAPSON does appear to be the lady who died in NEW SOUTH WALES; 1949 immigration aboard the "RANCHI" has her arriving into SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES.
It seems Gustave was missing, presumed dead.
Interestingly Gustave enlisted in CLAREMONT, WESTERN AUSTRALIA, locality at the time recorded as BRIDGETOWN, WESTERN AUSTRALIA.
Charles Alan DAVIES enlisted in PADDINGTON, NEW SOUTH WALES, locality at the time recorded as DOYLES CREEK, NEW SOUTH WALES.
DOYLES CREEK is in the SINGLETON area of NEW SOUTH WALES which is where, according to electoral rolls and cemetery records, Charles Alan DAVIES seems to have lived and died.




DEATH

Registration Number	Last Name	Given Name(s)	Father's Given Name(s)	Mother's Given Name(s)	District
81649/1974	DAVIES	AGNES MABEL	FREDERICK CHARLES	CAROLINE

(SOURCE: www.bdm.nsw.gov.au)

[dicole]

Gustave's CWGC entry says parents were Charles and Agnes Mabel Davies.

His name only is on the Singapore Memorial - this is what happened to his Battalion and why he has no known grave -


2/4th Machine Gun Battalion
Western Australia’s 2/4th Machine Gun Battalion was raised at the end of 1940 as one of the support units for the ill-fated 8th Division. Formed with men from across the state, they all came together at Northam military camp, east of Perth, where they carried out their initial training. In July 1941 the 2/4th moved to Adelaide and as more of the 8th Division was deployed “up north”, by October it was in Darwin with the 23rd Brigade. The division’s other two brigades were in Malaya and Singapore and the 2/4th was to follow.

Told of their move just before Christmas, the battalion left Darwin on 30 December, sailing via Port Moresby. Following a Japanese attack on Rabual, New Britain, the convey turned around and sailed to Sydney and then Fremantle. Sailing under escort the convoy finally reached Singapore at the end of January 1942. It was not long before the 2/4th was in action.

By this time the Japanese had captured Malaya and were preparing to attack Singapore. Similarly, the British were desperately preparing their defences and the battalion’s companies were sent where they were needed: B Company was sent to the British Manchester Fusiliers, constructing weapons pits around the Naval Base; C Company went to support the 44th Indian Brigade on the west and south-west coast of the island; D Company supported the 22nd Brigade on the north-west coast; and A Company was in the 8th Division’s reserve, close to the island centre.

After days of air raids, the Japanese attacked Singapore on 8 February - crossing the Johore Strait and attacking along the 22nd Brigade’s front and the 27th Brigade near the Causeway. Deployed to different units, the 2/4th’s companies were quickly in action but by 10 February the Japanese had captured the island’s west coast. Five days later the British forces were pushed back to a defensive line protecting the city. However, the battle was virtually over and on 15 February Lieutenant-General Arthur Percival surrendered Singapore.

The machine-gunners suffered heavily. Between 8 and 15 February the 2/4th had 137 men killed or missing, 106 men wounded, and 24 described as having “shell shock”. These casualties constituted almost one-third of the battalion. Worse was to follow, with the battalion held in Japanese prisoner of war camps for the next three and a half years.

Following the surrender, the 2/4th was concentrated in Changi goal. From Changi the Japanese took drafts of men to work throughout their Greater South East Asia Co-prosperity Sphere. Some of the battalion were sent to Borneo, while others worked on the Burma-Thai Railway or in Japan. By the war’s end, another 263 men from the battalion had died as prisoners.

---------------------------

If Charles and Gustave came out to Australia at different times, then its probable that they were not in the same place, or in contact with each other. You can find out lots about the Barnardos children now, so if it is important you may be able to find more information through WA state archives. Just a google search brings up lots of websites.

Di

[Jules]

Thanks for all the information. The death for Agnes above is the correct one, so thanks for that.
This poor family, Agnes was taken to the workhouse when she was just a baby as her Mother was taken to an Asylum and her Father was jailed for not looking after his children. Then she had her children taken off her and sent to the other side of the world. And then Gustave was killed when he was only 20, such a waste of life.
It seems that she had another son who was born in 1932, this was about the same time that Gustave was sent to Australia.
Thanks again for all the info. I am off to Google and see what might turn up.

Removal of name

[dicole]

Hi Jules

That is not another child in 1932, it is Gustave's registration. Perhaps Gustave's birth was not registered at the time but was registered before he went to Barnardos. If you look on the freeBMD website, search for births Davies mothers maiden name Rapson, there will be four entries (1920-1932). If you click on the last blue and red symbol, it tells about the entry -

"Births Mar 1932
Davies Gustave Rapson Pontypool 11a 206

The above transcription represents what is in the GRO index but it is referred to by the following entry
Births 1921 Dec: Davies,Gustave,Pontypool,11a,See M32
which implies that this is a late entry, that is an entry that has been registered in a quarter later than the event."


There is a link to another page which explains about late registrations.


There was also a registration for daughter of the same couple after Charles and Gustave, in 1924. Do you know anything about her ?


Di

[Jules]

Hi Di,

I saw that on Free bmd too, and have changed the records on the Tree that I have. Wonder what all that was about ?
No I know nothing about the daughter there is a marriage with the same name but that would only make her 14 so not sure about that.
Agnes was the youngest sister of my G Grandmother, when the family broke up all of the siblings were sent to various Workhouses/Ragged Schools or adopted out. One of the brothers was sent/taken to Canada and it seems lived there for the rest of his life. Another was in the Army and was killed in the first war. Another I can find no trace for, I suppose he took the family's name he was adopted to.
This search is for me, is trying to not let them be forgotten to the rest of the family. As it seems that Nanna had very little or no contact with her siblings from then on.
My Nanna was such a strong woman and her maternal instinct was a large part of her life, she never turned anyone away if they needed help.

[dicole]

Hi Jules,

This is certainly the place to get help to find lost siblings, the ladies here are pretty good detectives and love a good mystery.

I guess that Agnes either did not register Gustave, or it could not be found, so it was done in 1932.

By my count Agnes had a least 8 siblings, but I have not gone further than the 1901 census. I thought Ursula M Davies would be pretty easy to track, but it seems more common name than I thought.

I looked at the Electoral Rolls for NSW - I found Agnes in Wallsend, near Newcastle NSW, in 1954 and 1958, but I could not see anyone named Davies living near her. Don't know why she is not on the later Rolls, except if she was not capable of voting, maybe. There are no death or funeral notices listed in the Ryerson Index for either Agnes or Charles.

I found Charles Alan Davies (is this the right one ?) married in Scone in 1950. They are in the Electoral Rolls in Scone, in 1963 in Wallsend in 1963 and in Singleton NSW in 1980. I cannot see any adult children living with them in 1980, but because of the big gap from 1963-1980, they might have already left home.

If you are really determined to find any descendents of Agnes, it might be worth investigating the Barnardos route, they are much more open to sharing their records and re-uniting families now.

Cheers

Di

[Jac1971]

Hi Jules

I am the granddaughter of Charlie Davies and great granddaughter of Agnes Mabel Davies. Whereas I didn't know Agnes, my Mother has quite a few memories of her. When Gus was killed during the war he named Charlie as his next of kin. This was the catslyst for Pop to search for his Mother (Agnes) and once they got in touch he brought her out to Australia.

Charlie married Audrey Gee and they had 5 children, my Mother (Gail) being the oldest.

I know it's been quite a while since since you last posted here, and I don't know how successful your search has been, but I am quite happy to share with you all I know. I have contacted my Mother regarding this as well, and she is keen to get in contact with you. I'm not sure how to proceed from here as this familytreeforum is a new thing for me and I only stumbled over it when I google searched Agnes. Hopefully this message will get to you soon.

Look forward to hearing from you
Jackie (Jac)

[Katarzyna]

Jules is often around but you can contact Jules by sending her a private message (pm). Click on her name , then private message. Good luck.

[dicole]

Hi Jules

I am the granddaughter of Charlie Davies and great granddaughter of Agnes Mabel Davies. Whereas I didn't know Agnes, my Mother has quite a few memories of her. When Gus was killed during the war he named Charlie as his next of kin. This was the catslyst for Pop to search for his Mother (Agnes) and once they got in touch he brought her out to Australia.

Charlie married Audrey Gee and they had 5 children, my Mother (Gail) being the oldest.

I know it's been quite a while since since you last posted here, and I don't know how successful your search has been, but I am quite happy to share with you all I know. I have contacted my Mother regarding this as well, and she is keen to get in contact with you. I'm not sure how to proceed from here as this familytreeforum is a new thing for me and I only stumbled over it when I google searched Agnes. Hopefully this message will get to you soon.

Look forward to hearing from you
Jackie (Jac)

Wow, I knew this was just the place for Jules find more information, I hope see has been in touch with Jac !

[Jac1971]

Jules has been in touch. Thanks to everyone for your help - has been much appreciated!

[Christine in Herts]

Jules has been in touch. Thanks to everyone for your help - has been much appreciated!

Great news! Thank you for letting us know. Hope the contact is good for both.

Christine

[Jules]

Thank you for all your help. A long e-mail has been received and a long e-mail sent. A new section of family is back in the fold.

[Christine in Herts]

Thank you for all your help. A long e-mail has been received and a long e-mail sent. A new section of family is back in the fold.

That's lovely news.

Christine