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Brick wall - why can't I find him?

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  • Brick wall - why can't I find him?

    Hello! My first post of the forum and I hope someone can offer me some advice!

    I have been researching my step-dad's family tree and have been unable to find his grandfather or his family. All we knew is that his name is Edwin Webb (although Edward has also been used),he was from Kent and his brothers had very religious names.

    I finally made some progress recently by finding Edwin's marriage certificate which arrived today. His date of birth is approx 1892, his father was Ernest Webb who was a farmer.

    Despite this new information I can't Edwin or Ernest on any census! I have done every search I can think of and to no avail (e.g changing place of birth, name variations, ww1 records for Edwin).

    Have I missed something? If anyone can help me get over this very high wall I would be very much appreciative.

  • #2
    Hi and welcome to the forum.

    It might be an idea for one of the moderators to move this to the main family research board as more people are likely to see it there than on this one, unless there is something about your search that you don't wish to be more public.

    In any event to help we will need to have an idea of where in Kent we should be looking at. It might also help to know who the witnesses are on the marraige certificate as sometimes they are related to the bride and groom.

    Margaret

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    • #3
      Hi and thanks for the welcome! Sorry, wasn't sure where to post this so happy for it to be moved.

      He is said to have been born in Chatham but I don't have a birth certificate to prove it.

      The witnesses are unlikely to be relatives sadly. To provide a bit if back story this certificate was quite a revelation to my step-dad, Edwin and Elizabeth were married 20years or so after having children! The names of the witnesses are h.e. White and a.e. Peters, I suspect they are friends who knew they never got married.

      Sarah

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      • #4
        When did they marry and where were they living at the time?
        Margaret

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        • #5
          They married in Sept 1938 and they lived in Pagham, West Sussex

          Sarah

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          • #6
            Do you know places/dates of birth for eldest children? Any thoughts as to why they didn't marry earlier? eg one already married.

            Just thinking of trying to track back from earliest info you have.

            Margaret

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            • #7
              Hi Margaret,

              They had two children - Kathleen (dob approx. 1914, again unable to find on the bmd index) and Edward (May 1918). Places of birth are unknown, however Edward lived in Aldershot, Hampshire and I have a strong feeling he was born there too.

              I suspected someone was married before but my step-dad finds this hard to believe. The marriage certificate lists them as bachelor and spinster.

              It could be they just didn't get round to it. They never christened their children, which only came to light after Edward got married. The vicar who married Edward was outranged and took him straight back to the church to get christened!

              Comment


              • #8
                It would be most unusual for people to CHOOSE not to marry back then. And if they did make that very daring socially unacceptable choice, why bother marrying 20 years later? In my opinion, one of them was definitely already married.

                OC

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                • #9
                  Have you discounted the birth of Kathleen RAPLEY, mmn RAPLEY, in 1914? If this is your Kathleen, it does beg the question as to whether Edwin was her father or not, as he is not named on her BC.

                  OC

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                  • #10
                    Originally posted by Seg1988 View Post
                    Hi Margaret,

                    They had two children - Kathleen (dob approx. 1914, again unable to find on the bmd index) and Edward (May 1918). Places of birth are unknown, however Edward lived in Aldershot, Hampshire and I have a strong feeling he was born there too.

                    I suspected someone was married before but my step-dad finds this hard to believe. The marriage certificate lists them as bachelor and spinster.

                    It could be they just didn't get round to it. They never christened their children, which only came to light after Edward got married. The vicar who married Edward was outranged and took him straight back to the church to get christened!
                    Have you looked for the children's births under the mother's maiden name? If they were not married she may have felt that lying to the registrar was too much.

                    Margaret

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                    • #11
                      Margaret

                      Edward junior is registered as Webb, mmn Rapley. Kathleen is registered as Rapley, mmn Rapley.

                      OC

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Olde Crone Holden View Post
                        Margaret

                        Edward junior is registered as Webb, mmn Rapley. Kathleen is registered as Rapley, mmn Rapley.

                        OC
                        Thanks OC - I saw your post just after I did mine and have been looking for any earlier marriage etc for Elizabeth Rapley - there is a middle initial of R given for her and I wonder what that is as there are several like that.
                        Margaret

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                        • #13
                          There is also a Rhoda K WEbb, b 1916, mmn Rapley. Haven 't checked to see if she died. Have to go out now!

                          OC

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                          • #14
                            Elizabeth's middle name is Rhoda! She comes from a village which is highly populated with Rapleys and there are a couple of other Elizabeths born the same year as her. Fortunately most of the census' she is in feature her middle initial.

                            Amazing to find out about Kathleen! Will investigate that further when I get home

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                            • #15
                              Rhoda K Webb is Kathleen. Just found a marriage record for Rhoda K Webb and the surname of spouse (Green) matches who Kathleen married (and in Aldershot too!).

                              1916 year of birth also works and we know she was definitely at least a couple of years older than Edward (we weren't exactly sure and estimated 1914 based on family pictures).

                              Thanks for all your help with this!

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                              • #16
                                What is Elizabeth's date and place of birth/

                                Margaret

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                                • #17
                                  Originally posted by margaretmarch View Post
                                  What is Elizabeth's date and place of birth/

                                  Margaret
                                  She was born on 11 Sept 1890 in Chobham, Surrey. Her parents are George and Malvina B Rapley.

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                                  • #18
                                    Originally posted by Seg1988 View Post
                                    She was born on 11 Sept 1890 in Chobham, Surrey. Her parents are George and Malvina B Rapley.
                                    So Elizabeth could have married any time from 1906 onwards before she settled with Edwin/ward Webb but nothing is coming up on the index for that, so maybe it was his status that prevented an earlier marriage.
                                    Margaret
                                    Last edited by margaretmarch; 03-10-13, 17:00.

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                                    • #19
                                      What was Edwin's occupation?

                                      Margaret

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                                      • #20
                                        My theory is that Edwin Webb was born with a different surname, married in that name and then used the name Webb to hide himself from a cross wife or even from the recruiting officer for WW1 - not that that would have been much of a strategy as once conscription was brought in, he would have been picked up no matter what his alias was.

                                        Do you know if he saw active service in WW1?

                                        OC

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