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Will and Probate Research - How?

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  • Will and Probate Research - How?

    Hi All,

    Sorry to be thick - have read all I can about this but still cannot work out how to do it - do not have memberships at the moment but happy to go postal route (I think)

    Is it best to go for the Will or Probate or does one get both? Which one tells you the most ?Probate. Can you get one without the other? How do I find out whether Canterbury or York (are there only 2?)

    I want to get the Will (Probate would be good also) of

    1. William Foster b 12 December 1880 Forton Barracks, Alverstoke, Hampshire - d 13 September 1942 Clarendon Hill, Salisbury (?Plain), Wiltshire. I would also like to get the Coroners Report on this chap - is it possible and how do I do it? Everything on this chap appears to have disappeared i.e. military record for WWI (I have AB2 record) and Home Guard Record! I am not sure if he would have been regarded as dying in action - pretty sure Home Guard "non-hostility" mishaps are not considered "in action" even if there is a war on.

    2. James Rowland b c1763-1769) - Place of birth: Goodness knows where - ?Montgomeryshire ?Military - d 17 July 1846 Church Chase, Great Baddow, Essex - I am not sure if he made a Will but I imagine it is possible to check - he had been in the Military and they normally made Wills I believe.

    I would be eternally grateful for any help or advice anyone could give me - the second one, in particular, (Rowland) would knock down an extremely thick brick wall.

    Sue
    Last edited by Sue1; 26-08-13, 13:08. Reason: addition

  • #2
    The will is a record of what the person wanted done with his money/possessions - will give names of all who are to inherit and often gives helpful details of relationships - eg married names of daughters, names of nieces nephews etc, the probate part is a record of when the will was proved, what its worth and who the executors are. Its sensible to get both, especially as I don't think it costs more.

    Your James Rowland died before wills were recorded on a national basis so you'd need to search either the local church court or possibly the prerogative court of Canterbury if he had land in more than one area.

    Update
    I had a quick look on the wills index for your William Foster died 13 Sep 1942 and couldn't find one for him:(
    Last edited by JudithM; 26-08-13, 13:19.
    Judith passed away in October 2018

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    • #3
      I had a quick look on the wills index for your William Foster died 13 Sep 1942 and couldn't find one for him:([/QUOTE]

      Many thanks Judith. I am really surprised that William Foster did not make a Will - he apparently was a very organised chap, had three daughters and a wife.............amazing.

      Do you know how one applies to the Church Court - I know which churchyard he is buried in but presumably this is not what is meant by "Church Court". I don't think he owned any land.

      Sue
      Last edited by Sue1; 26-08-13, 15:07.

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      • #4
        Courts involved in proving wills were at archdeaconry or diocese level - your best bet would be to approach the County Record Office for the county/counties where your man lived and see if they hold wills and if they have an index. For general info have you looked at our Reference Library section on wills? http://www.familytreeforum.com/conte...ls-and-Probate
        Judith passed away in October 2018

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        • #5
          There is a listing on TNA for James Rowland from Montgmeryshire will possibly proved 1856 http://discovery.nationalarchives.go...ils?uri=D52071 and it costs £3.36 to download a copy of the Will.

          It may not be your man but there are no other results coming up. Don't forget Wills can be proved many years after a death.

          Margaret
          Last edited by margaretmarch; 26-08-13, 17:29.

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          • #6
            There are 3 articles in The Manchester Guardian in 1942 that report on Lieutenant William Foster who was killed while in the Home Guard near Salisbury. They give a brief description of the incident and the award of the George Cross. Do you already have these? If not, I can send them to you
            Jackie

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            • #7
              I assume this is the William Foster ..



              Have you seen his attestation papers in the Royal Fusiliers (1900) on FindMyPast ?
              Last edited by AntonyM; 26-08-13, 17:17.
              Retired professional researcher, and ex- deputy registrar, now based in Worcestershire. Happy to give any help or advice I can ( especially on matters of civil registration) - contact via PM or my website www.chalfontresearch.co.uk
              Follow me on Twittter @ChalfontR

              Comment


              • #8
                Hi Antony,

                No, I am not a member but I have in the past been and have not found them.

                Thanks for that, Sue

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                • #9
                  There is a listing on TNA for James Rowland from Montgmeryshire will possibly proved 1856 http://discovery.nationalarchives.go...ils?uri=D52071 and it costs £3.36 to download a copy of the Will.

                  It may not be your man but there are no other results coming up. Don't forget Wills can be proved many years after a death.



                  Hi Margaret,

                  I will have a go at the TNA website for James - I am amazed that it has been missed (not by me but there are 3 of us making no headway). I will have a good look at that - 10 years seems a long time to prove a will = I am sure there was nothing very much to "prove" but it is certainly worth a look. However, he died in Essex in 1846 - I would have thought the Will would have been proved from there BUT he did join the army originally (I have an old document which is proving not to be entirely accurate) in Newtown Montgomeryshire so this document says.

                  Thanks again for that.

                  Sue

                  Sue

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    [QUOTE=Sue1;2459200]There is a listing on TNA for James Rowland from Montgmeryshire will possibly proved 1856 http://discovery.nationalarchives.go...ils?uri=D52071 and it costs £3.36 to download a copy of the Will.

                    It may not be your man but there are no other results coming up. Don't forget Wills can be proved many years after a death.



                    Hi Margaret,

                    I will have a go at the TNA website for James - I am amazed that it has been missed (not by me but there are 3 of us making no headway). I will have a good look at that - 10 years seems a long time to prove a will = I am sure there was nothing very much to "prove" but it is certainly worth a look. However, he died in Essex in 1846 - I would have thought the Will would have been proved from there BUT he did join the army originally (I have an old document which is proving not to be entirely accurate) in Newtown Montgomeryshire so this document says.

                    Thanks again for that.

                    Sue

                    Have just had a look - it is definitely, sadly, not my James - he was not a farmer - he was a Tailor. I am beginning to think he was a Workhouse child and was perhaps sent to one of the Army's Schools to learn Tailoring. Have checked all other apprenticeships but zilch - however, if a member of the family teaches him it is not listed even though he gets the qualification. Have no idea where to go next with him.

                    Sue

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                    • #11
                      Hi Jackie, I would be delighted to see the Manchester Guardian Articles - I have seen the National Gazette bit and a local paper (local to Salisbury) and a National newspaper report - didn't realise Manchester had picked it up also.
                      Do you need me to pm you with an E-address.

                      Many thanks Sue

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                      • #12
                        Originally posted by Sue1 View Post
                        Hi Jackie, I would be delighted to see the Manchester Guardian Articles - I have seen the National Gazette bit and a local paper (local to Salisbury) and a National newspaper report - didn't realise Manchester had picked it up also.
                        Do you need me to pm you with an E-address.

                        Many thanks Sue
                        Yes please Sue.

                        I also Googled and there are loads of odd bits online, some of which I presume was posted by you. You may have seen these but just in case





                        Early in WW2, King George VI was deeply impressed by the heroic deeds of servicemen out of the front line and civilian non-combatants in acts connected with the war such as bomb disposal and rescues after air raids. So in September 1940 the King instituted the George Cross for 'For Gallantry' away from the heat of actual battle, to be awarded to civilians and servicemen and women. As the war progressed, the range of deeds increased. In April 1942 the unprecedented award of the GC was made to the entire population of the Island of Malta 'to honor her brave people'. Later the award was made for supreme gallantry to members of the Special Operations Executive, including Violette Szabo and Forest Yeo-Thomas (The White Rabbit). Many were posthumous. The George Cross continued to be awarded in the post war years and up to the present day, and this fine books covers all of these.
                        Jackie

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                        • #13
                          Hi Jackie,

                          Those threads are interesting - wonder where they got the photos from - I have both of them but I got one from the IWM (for whom I did a resume of his family, war service in AB2 War, WWI, Special Constable between wars during General Strike and Home Guard service - his records are all missing but I got the details from the War Diaries for WWI from TNA where I also got his service record (it did not contain a lot) for AB2 and the Home Guard details. It was incredibly interesting to put together but I also learned a lot. It is a little known fact that his only grandson (my half brother) was present when the accident occurred - he was about 7 - he was very fond of his grandfather and wanted to see what he did with the Home Guard and so was taken along for the day. He obviously was nowhere near the incident because he wasn't injured.
                          The other sad thing that occurred is that his wife, in her grief, threw all his medals away - she wanted her husband not medals. A few months ago his medal ribbons were found!

                          Sue
                          Last edited by Sue1; 26-08-13, 19:58.

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                          • #14
                            I've emailed the articles.

                            He sounds like an incredibly brave and interesting man. Sad about the medals but I can understand why his wife would have felt like that
                            Jackie

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                            • #15
                              I think I would have felt exactly the same.

                              The GC came later - it was awarded 4 months after his death by King George VI - it survived and is in Alderbury, Wiltshire.

                              If I knew how to put pictures on I would put one of him in his HG uniform - you would not know it was the same man - age certainly DID weary him.

                              Sue

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                              • #16
                                Have received the articles and absolutely delighted with them .................one of them told me something I hadn't know i.e. that he had retired 2 years previously - thought he was still working.

                                Many, many thanks. Sue

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                                • #17
                                  You're welcome. Happy to have helped
                                  Jackie

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                                  • #18
                                    Oh my goodness! Not sure what I think of what I have just read on the link you sent me!

                                    The Wardrobe in Wiltshire are selling a photo of my grandfather at £5 a throw! Should I be flattered. I am actually quite astounded. On the other hand I might be very kind and send them it's twin but it is him in Home Guard Uniform instead of him in Royal Fusilier Uniform which would be more relevant to them.

                                    Sue
                                    Last edited by Sue1; 26-08-13, 23:03.

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                                    • #19
                                      I suppose it is a charitable trust and they have to cover their costs. I would be more bothered if it was a profit making organisation.
                                      Jackie

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