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julite
16-04-13, 10:37
I’m going round in ever decreasing circles searching for Frank Stoneman – I’ve found the following records:
Birth – 1869 Portsea;
Censuses – 1871 Lambeth; 1881 Clee w Weelsby; 1891 Wheatley, Yorkshire; 1911 – Uttoxeter
Marriage – 1890 Caistor (to Emily Allmand Smith b 1870)
The 1911 Census indicates a marriage to Sarah Ellen Lunn (b1879) in c1905, but I can’t find it. Neither can I find a prior death of his first wife Emily. I can’t find him in 1901 to see whether Emily was still alive then. I have found a marriage in 1900 to Mary Slater – it gives the right age and the right name for his father who’s not identified as deceased (Frank born in Exeter c 1844 – can’t find his birth and he becomes similarly elusive after 1881 though his wife Annie seems to have remarried in 1888) ) and the same job – carter – as given in 1911 (previously employed by railways/ Grimsby Docks).

So – what happened to Emily? Where is he in 1901 – was Emily still his wife or was it Mary? Did he marry Sarah? What happened to him/her after 1911?

I’m probably missing the obvious, but I’ve tried varied spellings/dates to no avail – apart from terminal frustration. Any advice – including ‘Give up’ would be welcome!

liz hutchison
16-04-13, 12:45
Hi in the 1911 Census he and his wife Sarah Ellenvisting her parents at 32 Bridge Road,Uttoxeter, he married Sarah Ellen Lunn abt 1905.Lizzy

julite
16-04-13, 12:58
Thanks Lizzy - unfortunately that's the only indication there is of a marriage - nothing on the register index/Family Search and I can't find hide nor hair of them after 1911. I just wonder whether Frank was as frank as he should have been! Julite

Darksecretz
16-04-13, 13:19
sounds to me like a case of Bigamy... try splitting it down, look 'just' for Emily in the census, could she be with her family mother/father/siblings?? and listing herself as single? did she remarry?

Darksecretz
16-04-13, 14:00
I can tell you that in 1922 he emigrated to New York State, he is in Niagra falls for the 1930 US census! and he is single working as an attendant in a gas works!

Name: Frank Stoneman
Gender: Male
Birth Year: abt 1871
Birthplace: England
Race: White
Home in 1930: Niagara Falls, Niagara, New York

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=1930usfedcen&h=43446347&indiv=try&o_vc=Record%3aOtherRecord&rhSource=2352

Darksecretz
16-04-13, 14:01
from Ancestrys Railway records

Name: Frank Stoneman
Age: 25
Birth Date: abt 1869
Residence Date: 25 Sep 1894
Company: Manchester, Sheffield and Lincolnshire
Class Number: 463
Piece: 243
Description: Staff register: 4841 - 5342 No. 10 1892 - 1896

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=ukrailway&h=255857&indiv=try&o_vc=Record:OtherRecord&rhSource=2352

julite
16-04-13, 14:09
Thanks DS - bigamy had crossed my mind - but how do I find out the fate of Emily, possibly Mary and more importantly for me, Sarah. I saw the US record but couldn't find the frankly annoying Frank on any passenger list. I have found a Sarah Ellen Stoneman's marriage in 1914, with an alias of Sarah Ellen Holbrook - now awaiting GRO to dash that avenue!

Darksecretz
16-04-13, 14:24
hmmmn I have just been looking again and I have found a Frank Stoneman in CANADA in 1911 [all the dates tally up, UK 1911 cens taken in april, Canadian one taken in JUNE] so he could have gone from UK just after the UK census to be in Canada for their census.

the image is not very good but shows an immigration yr of 1911!.

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?db=1911Canada&h=5578844&indiv=try&o_vc=Record:OtherRecord&rhSource=6598

Name: Frank Stoneman
Gender: Male
Marital Status: Married
Age: 40
Birth Date: Jun 1870
Birthplace: England
Relation to Head of House: Laborer

Janet in Yorkshire
16-04-13, 14:25
Unless you can find proof that he did marry Sarah whilst Emily (or any other former wife) was still alive, then he may have been a philanderer but he wasn't a bigamist. Bigamy (marrying a third party whilst already having a living spouse) was a crime; living as man and wife, filling in forms as man and wife and calling yourself Mrs xxxxxx wasn't against the law and wasn't bigamy.

Darksecretz
16-04-13, 14:31
ooher!

Name: Emily A E Stoneman
Age: 29
Estimated Birth Year: abt 1872
Relationship: Sister-in-law
Gender: Female
Where born: England
Registration number: 453
Registration district: St Andrews and St Leonards
Civil parish: St Andrews and St Leonards
Town: St Andrews
County: Fife
Address: Kinnellar

1901 SCOTLAND CENSUS http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?rank=1&new=1&MSAV=1&msT=1&gss=angs-g&gsfn=emi**+A&gsln=*toneman&msbdy=1870&msbpn__ftp=Lincolnshire%2c+England&msbpn=5273&msbpn_PInfo=7-%7c0%7c0%7c3257%7c3251%7c0%7c0%7c0%7c5273%7c0%7c0% 7c&cpxt=1&catBucket=rstp&uidh=lg3&msbdp=2&cp=11&pcat=ROOT_CATEGORY&h=737974&db=1901Scotland&indiv=1


nope forget that!! she is also in same place for 1891 rats!

Darksecretz
16-04-13, 14:35
this looks possible!

Name: Emily Stoneman
Spouse Surname: Guy
Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1916
Registration district: Grimsby
Inferred County: Lincolnshire
Volume Number: 7a
Page Number: 1594

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bin/sse.dll?rank=1&new=1&MSAV=1&msT=1&gss=angs-g&gsfn=emi**+A&gsln=*toneman&msbdy=1870&msbpn__ftp=Lincolnshire%2c+England&msbpn=5273&msbpn_PInfo=7-%7c0%7c0%7c3257%7c3251%7c0%7c0%7c0%7c5273%7c0%7c0% 7c&cpxt=1&catBucket=rstp&uidh=lg3&msbdp=2&cp=11&pcat=ROOT_CATEGORY&h=63869176&db=ONSmarriage1984&indiv=1

susan h
17-04-13, 00:32
I wonder is this Frank in 1901? He's with wife Mary but enumerated as Frank Stevenson, Stevenson could be an enumerators error, or maybe the census form filled out was bad writing and the enumerator thought it said Stevenson. I cannot find a Frank Stevenson born circa 1869 Portsea Hampshire on any other census. Frank Stoneman and Mary Slater married in Wavertree Liverpool and Frank's occupation was a Carter, Frank Stevenson is living in Wavertree Liverpool and he's a Carter, also Mary's age matches with her age at marriage. Maybe it's coincidence but if so where was Frank Stevenson before 1901?

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7814&iid=LANRG13_3504_3506-0306&fn=Frank&ln=Stevenson&st=r&ssrc=&pid=21755467

susan h
17-04-13, 01:49
Gosh Julite, nothing's straightforward with these people is it? Who is Mary Stoneman entered as mother on the 1891 census, is she Emily's mother who has been listed with an incorrect surname? Have you found Emily on census returns before her marriage? Have you found her birth, I think she was possibly born Emily Allmond!!!

It's certainly a tangled web, you must feel frustrated by them all. I'll keep looking for clues.

julite
17-04-13, 08:59
Many thanks Susan. I had found a Mary Stoneham in Liverpool - right age, but widowed, but couldn't find a death 1900-01 for Frank, so I think the one you found is probably him, but I wonder what had happened to Emily. I've done a trawl of people with birth registration - forenames including Allmand and found a Henry Allmand Smith born just a few years after Emily, but can't find him or Emily in 1881. Frank's father, Frank (why couldn't they have chosen more exotic names?!) is another niggle - can't find his birth or death and his wife - Annie Dent seems to get younger as time goes by, as well as remarrying in 1888, when Fran senior appears on the marriage details of Frank junior in 1900. The Stonemans/men aren't really my focus - I'm just very curious - well nosey! My actual target is his possible wife 3 (according to the 1911 census) Sarah Ellen Lunn.