John Wakeman, missing on two censuses?

[Guest]

Hello all

I can find my gr grandad John James Wakeman on 3 censuses.
In 1871 he was living at 20 Coleman Place (I think) with his widowed mother Caroline and sister Alice
In 1891 he was living at 20 Frayland(?) Rd, with mother and step-father, Ralph Smith
In 1911 he was living at 8 Winch Pl, Deacon Street (all addresses in Camberwell) with 2nd wife Alice and son John and daughters Florence, Ada, Alice, Lily, Lizzie and Nellie


I just cannot find him in 1881 or 1901 - any help would be much appreciated, thanks

Amanda

[Night Owl]

They're here in 1881 as Wateman (over 2 pages)

RG11 piece 696, folio 94, pages 34 and 35

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7572&iid=LNDRG11_695_697-0486&fn=Caroline&ln=Wateman&st=r&ssrc=&pid=21236435

[Guest]

Jackie, thank you SO much, and so quick!

[Night Owl]

Am I right in thinking that his first wife was Emma Stanbra and that she died in 1900? I've a feeling this is him in 1901 with a wife called Martha. Age is a bit out but the children Florrie and Ada fit

RG13, piece 514, folio 17, page 21

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=7814&iid=LNDRG13_513_515-0298&fn=Ada&ln=Wakeman&st=r&ssrc=&pid=3892538

[Elaine ..Spain]

Just about to post the same as Jackie.

[Guest]

Thank you again, Jackie, and Elaine.

Yes, this looks like him and FLorence and Ada right enough. But the Martha is definitely wrong, however it may just have been an info error on their part. Emma died of flu in 1900 and John married Alice Ann Smith in 1902. She was born in 1883 so age really should be 18!! - maybe 30 made it all look a bit more respectable?

But ALice's mother's name was Martha. If Alice was 18 maybe they put Martha's details down to make it look better??

Many thanks again all.
P.s. a nice little story from the marriage of John and Alice. They went on to have 5 more children. One of which Nellie had two children, Gerald and Donald. Quite a while ago my mum started going to a ladies club at a local church hall to where she lives. She met a lady called Chris - who happened to be married to mum's cousin, Gerald!!!! Small world

Amanda

[JudithM]

I doubt if the Martha with John in 1901 was the same person as Alice. I can believe they might lie about age but they have also put her place of birth down as Northampton, whilst Alice in 1911 has Walworth as her pob. With name, age and place of birth all not matching, and the marriage to Alice not taking place until 1902 it seems much more likely that Martha was someone John had moved in to help look after the children (or other home comforts!) and had moved on by the time he married Alice.

[Guest]

Hmmmm, good thought, JudithM, thanks