John Alfred Riddel - filling a gap

[Uncle John]

A recent contact through FTF has added a new twig to my Riddel family. Charles Robert Riddel (1854-1943) and Jessie McGill (1854-1946) had 4 daughters followed by 2 sons. Places of birth are relevant because they moved around a lot.

Charles Robert Riddell (Inverness 1854 - Pollok 1943). In the mid-1890s he was in St. Petersburg managing a thread works ( asubsidiary of J & M Coats). Back in Gourock 1898 for the birth of John Alfred. Not seen after that but his obituary says he was also in Barcelona. Possibly returned to Glasgow on retirement (circa 1920).
Jessie McGill married Charles in 1879 in Glasgow. In 1911 she and son David are in Accrington where he's involved in mill machinery. She died at daughter Charlotte's country pile in Berkshire.

Mary Woodburn Riddel (Pollokshields 1880 - North Shields 1912) married Rowland Lishman in 1905 and died in childbirth in 1912. Not seen in 1901. Sorted.
Christina Hutton Riddel (Blantyre 1881 - Wandsworth 1966) died a spinster. Not seen in 1901 or 1911. Otherwise sorted.
Jessie McGill Riddel (Dunoon 1884 - Kensington 1963) married Alexander Dewar in 1904. Not seen in 1901. Otherwise sorted.
Charlotte Josephine Riddel (Paisley 1888 - Westminster 1974) married Alexander Davidson in 1919. Not seen in 1901 or 1911. Otherwise sorted.
Charles David Riddel (St. Petersburg 1895 - Blackburn 1964) married Winifred Milnes 1918. Not seen in 1901. Mill machinery engineer.
And finally:
John Alfred Riddel (Gourock 1898 - emigrated to South Africa circa 1937). Not seen 1901 or 1911. Joined the Tank Corps 1918. Medal card 1922, by which time he's a merchant sailing back to Glasgow from Singapore. Married Kathleen Folker 1923 in Epsom, where son Ian is born in 1924. He then disappears completely.
Kathleen and son Ian sail to Durban in 1937 by which time she's a SA citizen. In 1958/9 she makes a return trip from SA to Walmer, Kent.

So what I'd like to know is: what happened to John Alfred? Where is father Robert? And any other sightings.

Off to cook dinner.

[Christine in Herts]

What sort of mistranscriptions have you allowed for in your searches? I can imagine that RIDDEL is ripe for both variants and errors.

Christine

[Uncle John]

Mostly Ridd*. The most common mistake (rather than mistranscription) is a double l ending. I haven't found any transcriptions as Riddle.

[Elaine]

Did find this

Name: RIDDEL, JOHN ALFRED
Date Of Death: 19610000
Passport Number: 414576
Source Location: National Archives, Pretoria (TAB)
Reference: 173/61
Source: Master of the Supreme Court, Pretoria (MHG)
Collection Name: Transvaal Deceased Estates Index 1855 - 1976

http://ancestry24.com/search-item/?id=C2465295

but didn't venture into the site

cross refernced here

http://www.national.archsrch.gov.za/sm300cv/smws/sm30ddf0?2013022423363473BC3785&DN=00000008

and found

DEPOT TAB
SOURCE MHG
TYPE LEER
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 2173/61
PART 1
DESCRIPTION RIDDEL, JOHN ALFRED.
STARTING 19610000
ENDING 19610000
REMARKS SURVIVING SPOUSE KATHLEEN MARGARET RIDDEL. (BORN SHEPHARD FOLKER).

[Elaine]

Also

http://www.national.archsrch.gov.za/sm300cv/smws/sm30ddf0?2013022423424273BC3785&DN=00000013

DEPOT TAB
SOURCE WLD
TYPE LEER
VOLUME_NO 0
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 1910/1946
PART 1
DESCRIPTION ILLIQUID CASE DIVORCE KATHLEEN MARGARET RIDDEL (BORN
SHEPHERD-FOLKER) VERSUS JOHN ALFRED.
STARTING 19460000
ENDING 19460000

http://www.national.archsrch.gov.za/sm300cv/smws/sm30ddf0?2013022423403973BC3785&DN=00000016

DEPOT TAB
SOURCE TPD
TYPE LEER
SYSTEM 01
REFERENCE 41/1953
PART 1
DESCRIPTION LAND SALE. KATHLEEN MARGARET RIDDEL VERSUS GERT JOHANNES DANIEL
JORDAAN.
STARTING 19530000
ENDING 19530000

[Uncle John]

Thanks very much Elaine for filling in some blanks. This is a remote twig on my tree so I'm not minded to subscribe to ancestry24 but I'll do as you did, sniffing round the outside. The national archives link is also an excellent lead. My FTF contact is more interested in John Alfred's WWI record than what happened afterwards. I found Kathleen's name by Googling for John Alfred - found a Folker family tree.

[Uncle John]

I see that Ancestry24 is closing down at the end of February.

[Elaine]

Was just about to let you know

[Uncle John]

Getting back to John Alfred Riddel, this is what I now know:

Born 1898 Gourock. Can't find him in 1901 (or anyone else in the family, for that matter) or 1911. Mum and elder brother Charles (b. Russia) are in Accrington.
Medal card dated 1918 puts him in the Tank Corps in France. He is mentioned twice in the London Gazette in 1918.
In 1922 he's living in Pollokshields, Glasgow (address on the medal card and found incoming to UK from Singapore).
In q2 1923 he marries Kathleen Shepherd-Folker in Epsom. Son Ian born Epsom 1924 and then at some stage they all emigrate to South Africa.
They divorce in 1946 and he dies in 1961.
Son Ian was in the South African Navy during WWII. He died about 1999.

Can anyone find any more of John Alfred's war record, please?

[AntonyM]

On his medal card he is shown as "2nd Lieutenant" and as an officer his service record should survive at The National Archives at Kew in series WO 339 or WO 374. They are usually quite straightforward to find , but not available on-line.

He may also get a mention in the battalion war diaries in WO 95 - to confirm the battalion, you will need to look at the service record, or the Tank Corps medal roll (using the reference on the Medal Roll Index Card).

My grandfather was in the Tank Corps so I have spent some time digging through their records at TNA - a huge amount survives.

[annswabey]

This file at the National Archives is for a John Alfred Riddel , 2 Lt, Tank Corps, so I assume it's him

WO339/117315

[Uncle John]

Grateful thanks everyone. I'll point my contact in the direction of this thread.