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Two years on, and still lost!

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  • Two years on, and still lost!

    Hi all,
    I'm going back to some research that I began a few years ago and ran into a brick wall. Thought I'd have a break and attack it again.
    I would truly appreciate any help you may be able to give as it is the missing name I need on my five generation tree that I would like printing. I'll be honest, I'd pay to find out I'm getting that frustrated with it.

    I'm researching my Great Grandmother Emily Smith, born 1878, married Arthur Horton (1897), then married a Thomas Nicholls (1909). (My Great Grandfather).

    I'm looking to get Emily's birth certifcate and GRO need her mothers name. (That's why I need her birth cert!!).

    The problem is there is a discrepancy between dates and locations.

    In the 1901 Census it says she was born in Willenhall and she is living with Arthur Horton (b1865) in Wednesfield, Staffs, and has 2 children May & Emily.
    In the 1911 Census, Arthur has died (1909) and she has married Thomas Nicholls (b1878). She still has May & Emily (But now with different years of birth - as is hers) and a new son - Thomas. (He is classed as Horton in certain transcriptions but on census is a Nicholls). It also says she now is born in Hull, York (In 1911 census)
    If you put the two side by side, you notice the minor differences (errors??) - but there are too many similarities for them not to be the same family.
    Her father, William Smith, is deceased in 1909 and was a coal miner (Acording to her marriage cert).
    I have the original marriage certificate from her 1909 marriage to Thomas Nicholls and 1897 marriage to Arthur Horton.
    I am (deep down) inclined to think that the 1911 Census is more accurate as it was filled in by the head of house and not an enumerator - but there's no details on her living in Hull.

    I would be so grateful for anyone that can help.
    Thankyou
    Kind Regards
    Matt

  • #2
    not quite with you why do the GRO need her mothers name for you to get her birth cert ?

    Comment


    • #3
      Matt,

      can you provide the witness' names on the marriage certs please, [have you checked that these could be family members?]

      Like Val, am a little unsure as to why the GRO need the Mothers name... [not unless there are multiple Emily's and you need this to 'pick' the right one?]
      Julie
      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

      .......I find dead people

      Comment


      • #4
        Thankyou both very much for your quick responses. Really appreciated.
        I apologise about the GRO - I was getting confused.
        The witnessess on the 1909 marriage certificate are a John Froggatt and a Elizabeth Froggatt. Never heard of them and they might be friends of my Great Grandfather.
        Her address at time of 1909 marr was 3 Deans Road Moseley Village - obviously stayed after Arthur died.
        The witnesses on the 1897 marriage to Arthur are John Ralph & Elizabeth Ralph.
        Thanks again.

        Comment


        • #5
          Originally posted by crashmatt View Post

          In the 1901 Census it says she was born in Willenhall and she is living with Arthur Horton (b1865) in Wednesfield, Staffs, and has 2 children May & Emily.
          Can you give the reference for this census, or a link to it?
          Elaine







          Comment


          • #6
            Matt

            can you give a direct link to Ancestry I am having a devil of a time trying to find them at all in 1901!!
            Julie
            They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

            .......I find dead people

            Comment


            • #7
              Hi Elaine, I'm a little unsure how to do that.
              Would this be right?
              Piece:2688Folio:149
              Page: 4
              Registration District: Wolverhampton
              Civil Parish: Heath Town
              Municipal Borough:
              Address: 202, Moseley Village, Heath Town, Moseley
              County: Staffordshire

              Kind Regards

              Comment


              • #8
                snap Elaine... lol
                Julie
                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                .......I find dead people

                Comment


                • #9
                  I've found it in FMP Julie, but can't match it to Ancestry.
                  Ref is Piece: 2688 Folio: 149 Page: 4 - but that brings up something different when you put it into Ancestry!! So one of them is wrong.
                  Elaine







                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Matt, to direct link you need to have the page that you want to show us open [say the 1901 census on ancestry] then click and copy the address bar on ancestry and paste it into this thread, when we click on it, it will take us directly to the page you want us to see. [easy when you know how :smilee:]
                    Julie
                    They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                    .......I find dead people

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Elaine ..Spain View Post
                      I've found it in FMP Julie, but can't match it to Ancestry.
                      Ref is Piece: 2688 Folio: 149 Page: 4 - but that brings up something different when you put it into Ancestry!! So one of them is wrong.
                      pooooooooooooooooooo I bet they are mistrans!...
                      Julie
                      They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                      .......I find dead people

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Link to the image - http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?h...=&pid=34917891
                        Elaine







                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Mistranscribed as Harton on Ancestry!
                          Begin your discovery today by exploring the world's largest online family history resource!
                          Elaine







                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Find My Past


                            I'm sorry I don't have a Ancestry paid for subscription at the moment as I was trying FMP.
                            Is that OK?.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Thanks Matt.. that looks like it might work, though I don't sub to FMP but I know those that do... and Ancestry is 'down' again for me!!...poooooooooooooo
                              Julie
                              They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                              .......I find dead people

                              Comment


                              • #16
                                That's fine Matt. I've given the same Ancestry link so Julie can see it there ... when Ancestry sorts itself out! :D
                                Elaine







                                Comment


                                • #17
                                  There's a John Froggatt marrying Elizabeth Nicholls Staffs 1906

                                  I think John Ralph married Elizabeth Taylor but I've only looked in Staffs
                                  Elaine

                                  Looking for Ward, Moore, Hunt, Warren...and who was Gertrude Wills

                                  http://leicestermoores.tribalpages.com
                                  http://wardnottsleics.tribalpages.com

                                  Comment


                                  • #18
                                    Does her age on the marriage certificates match up with the ages given in the census?
                                    Elaine







                                    Comment


                                    • #19
                                      Yes Elaine they do match up.

                                      Comment


                                      • #20
                                        John Froggat, from what I can establish married Elizabeth Nicholls (Thomas's Mother) in 1906 after her previous husband Henry died in 1900.

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