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  • Arthur Dyer

    Hi

    I would really appreciate some help on tracing an uncle who is I am sure dead by now but need to find out about him before I can go further with any children. The facts that I have are as follows:

    Arthur Dyer was born in March 1910 in St Pancras, London the youngest son of David and Clara Dyer nee Woods. David, the father, died in December 1910 and Clara, his mother died in 1919 after having married Henry Knight and having a daughter, Dorothy, in 1915. Henry died in 1918/19 also. I know that Dorothy was adopted privately by a wealthy family but have never been able to track down what happened to Arthur.

    My father, Frederick, was the eldest been born in 1900 and presumably by the time his mother died he was of age when he had been independent of her. There was a middle son, Edward who I have the relevant family contacts for.

    Would anyone be able to give some advice/suggestions as to what I can do to see if I can track the elusive Arthur down.

    Many thanks

  • #2
    in the 1911, clara is with edward and arthur (frederick not there) but i wouldnt trust the form, it says arthur is 1 and a dressmaker with his own account
    Lorraine

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    • #3
      Hi - Yes that is the correct family. I have found Frederick elsewhere on the 1911 but thats another story for another day! Thank you

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      • #4
        Looking at the birth index, the only Arthur Dyer born in Pancras in 1910 had the middle name Ernest.

        That might help you eliminate some of the Arthur Dyers in the death registration index - I've had a quick look, but there seem to be several possibilites.
        Do you know if Arthur E served in WW2? And if so, in which force?

        Jay
        Jay
        Janet in Yorkshire



        Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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        • #5
          Hi Janet - I found the Arthur Ernest record also and assumed that this was him although I will send off for the certificate. Whilst I have nothing to base it on I seem to have some distant thought that perhaps he served in WWII but have absolutely no idea as to regiment etc. I did do a search somewhile ago but didn't come up with anything.

          I have spent today churning this over in my mind and it suddenly dawned on me he would have been only 9 when his mother died so what would have happened to him. The fact that his half sister was privately adopted he may have been too but again no idea where to go for that. When i found Dorothy's information it was all by pure chance and the family were not too up front with the information which I can quite understand.

          Thanks

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          • #6
            dont know if this is relevant but there is a marriage in Dec 1933 Pancras 1B 82 for a Arthur E Dyer and an Eliza Waller ?

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            • #7
              could this be arthur and frederick in 1918



              possibly not though if you have your dads history.

              .. or probably not old enough for ER
              Last edited by loltel; 23-01-13, 20:13.
              Lorraine

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              • #8
                I saw that marriage Val, and then went on to look for possible children. I thought there could have been 4

                There is an added complication re possible children - in 1931 John C Dyer married Gertrude Waller in 1931. I think he possibly died in Croydon in 1993. So, the 4 birth regs need not all have been for the same couple. The last one I found was in Cheshire and there was also a death reg for an Arthur E in Cheshire in 1965, aged 55 yrs.

                Only guess work though and I can't put names up on here.

                Jay
                Janet in Yorkshire



                Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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                • #9
                  there is also this death Alan Ernest Dyer born 8 Jun 1935 died Apr 1990 in Thanet Kent ??? 16 1641 490

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                  • #10
                    the only two children I thought could be his were both born in Pancras ? its a long shot of course

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                    • #11
                      I think both those were most likely Arthur's children.

                      However, MMN for 2 more Dyer children was Waller - an earlier and a later birth.

                      I could find 2 Dyer/Waller marriages.

                      Val, should you delete the two names in the births, or at least the girl's, if you think the son is also now deceased?

                      Jay
                      Janet in Yorkshire



                      Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Gill I asked about service in WW2 incase he had been killed in action - but having looked at the Commonwealth war graves site, I don't think he was.

                        Legal adoption only came in c1927, so any arrangements made before then were always "informal" - often children were taken in by other extended family members and if they were very young, they didn't always realise that they had been "taken in". Some went into orphanages and homes, others to the workhouse, although by 1910+ they were often boarded out with foster parents or placed in a home.

                        Jay
                        Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 23-01-13, 20:40.
                        Janet in Yorkshire



                        Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Hi - I only went to eat my dinner and there has been all of this activity. Thank you.

                          I can't remember if I said earlier in my dim and distant thoughts - Chester or maybe Cheshire is there but I have no idea where I could have got that from. I sometimes wonder if we make these things up as I have nothing to base this on!

                          Re the ER names - I think they would have have been too young, Arthur would have been 9 and Frederick 10 in 1918!

                          Perhaps my best bet is to get the death certificate for Arthur in Cheshire and see if the informants names tie in anywhere. Would you agree that this is the best route forward?

                          Thanks again

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                          • #14
                            I have taken the two childrens names off and sent them by pm now, I only chose those two names as they are in Pancras, could be completely wrong of course.
                            I would send for the marriage cert between Arthur E Dyer and Eliza Waller if it was me , but its entirely up to you whether you send for it, maybe you could put a check on it asking if its the right fathers name ??

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                            • #15
                              Interesting that Cheshire rings a bell. The death there was in the West Cheshire reg Dist in 1965 - age & middle initial fit with your man. The possible Cheshire birth was of a daughter, in Runcorn in 1942. IF the Pancras marriage was YOUR Arthur, 1942 was during WW2 and I would guess Arthur would either have been in the forces or in a reserved occupation; his wife & young children may have been evacuated, or could have moved out of London to stay with relatives, or Arthur could have been posted or in employment there.

                              1911 census doesn't record a young Arthur Dyer residing in Cheshire or Lancashire.

                              I'm not sure how revealing the death cert would be at this point - perhaps it's the St Pancras marriage cert you ought to invest in, father's name would be a check with what you already know???? We know that chap married an Eliza, but having an Eliza as informant of the death doesn't alone prove he's your man.

                              Jay

                              Val, great minds think alike re the cert! (Was on the phone, so didn't see your post, lol)
                              Last edited by Janet in Yorkshire; 23-01-13, 21:17.
                              Janet in Yorkshire



                              Genealogists never die - they just swap places in the family tree

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                              • #16
                                Probably a red herring, but my Latin teacher at school (near Rotherham) was a Mr Dyer. In 1960 he would have been in his mid-30s.
                                Uncle John - Passed away March 2020

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                                • #17
                                  Hi Doing some further research I was looking at the ER and guess what I found my Dad (Frederick) living with Arthur Ernest (his brother) and low and behold Eliza Waller lives a couple of doors down the road. I think this must be the connection that was mentioned previously. Made me smile

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