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I am trying to locate the birth record for James Elliot. His birth is one of my brick walls, although I did recently make progress on him thanks to Ancestry making their WW1 army service records available during Rememberance weekend. Until this point I didn't know either parents name, but was able to find him thanks to next of kin details.
I actually know a surprising amount about him, (apologies it's quite long) but I thought it best to include everything, please see below.
So, my question is where to look next? My thoughts are: as his surname is Elliot this suggests that either Mary Ann was married previously to another Elliot; or he was born out of marriage and has taken Mary Ann's surname. I have seen on other Scottish records "reputed father" against the fathers name. I guess I would like to know if that is the case here, or whether it really is a blank box.
Will the best option be to systematically work my way through all James Elliot's born in Roxburgh initially in 1883 until I find one with the correct mother? Or are there any other sources of information I am missing?
Many thanks in advance for any advice
Geri
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Date of birth: 21 April 1883 (calculated from WW1 records age at joining 31 years 167 days and date of joining 5 October 1914)
Location of birth: Newcastleton, Hawick, Roxburghshire (WW1 records)
Location of birth: Castleton, Roxburghshire (possible 1891 census)
Location of birth: Scotland (possible 1901 census)
Location of birth: Newcastleton, Roxburghshire (1911 census)
Marriage: Georgina White 19 March 1904 Bellingham, Northumberland; James's Father: blank (I have the certificate)
Date of death: 15 August 1916, France (WW1 records)
Information from WW1 records
Widow of soldier: Georgina Fitzpatrick (Georgina remarried in 1918 to John J Fitzpatrick)
Children of soldier: four born between 1902 and 1912
Father of Soldier: George Forsyth (Stepfather)
Mother of Soldier: Mary Ann Forsyth (Marriage to stepfather - 7 December 1888, Castleton, Roxburghshire, Mary Ann's mother Annie Elliot nee Elliot, Mary Ann's father James Elliot, Mary Ann is described as Spinster)
Half blood brothers/sisters of soldier: two
James Elliot census references:
1891 - RG12, Piece 784, Folio 12, Page 3 - however the age is incorrect by 3 years, but appears to be living with Mary Ann's parents, described as grandson
1901 - RG13, Piece 4840, Folio 12, Page 16 - most likely candidate that I have found
1911 - RG14, Piece 30856 RG78PN1763 RD560 SD1 ED10 SN23
Mary Ann Elliot/Forsyth census references:
1871 - RG10, Piece 784, Folio 12, Page 6 - most likely candidate
1881 - RG11, Piece 5111, Folio 87, Page 6 - most likely candidate
1891 - RG12, Pice 4249, Folio 16, Page 26 - {looks like possible candidate but number children per 1911 census wouldn't work and Robert and George aren't listed on the WW1 records}
1901 - RG13, Piece 4826, Folio 11, Page 14 {looks like possible candidate but number children per 1911 census wouldn't work and Robert and George aren't listed on the WW1 records}
1911 - RG14, Piece 30919 RG78PN1768 RD561 SD2 ED10 {note married 22 years, 4 children, 3 living}
Possible Births I have already got the certificates/Scottish records for:
- Q2 1883 Bellingham, Northumberland - I have the certificate, date of birth 14th April 1883, Mother Betsy Elliot (was Robson), Father James Elliot - struggling to track this family on the census but appears to be incorrect mother's name although the date of birth is only a week out
- 12 July 1883 - James Oliver Elliot, Castleton, Roxburghshire - definitely not this one as he can be tracked to living with his parents in hampshire in 1911
- 3 September 1882 - James Elliot, Newcastleton, Roxburghshire - definitely not this one as he died in 1904 before the date of marriage to Georgina
I actually know a surprising amount about him, (apologies it's quite long) but I thought it best to include everything, please see below.
So, my question is where to look next? My thoughts are: as his surname is Elliot this suggests that either Mary Ann was married previously to another Elliot; or he was born out of marriage and has taken Mary Ann's surname. I have seen on other Scottish records "reputed father" against the fathers name. I guess I would like to know if that is the case here, or whether it really is a blank box.
Will the best option be to systematically work my way through all James Elliot's born in Roxburgh initially in 1883 until I find one with the correct mother? Or are there any other sources of information I am missing?
Many thanks in advance for any advice
Geri
----------------------------------------------------
Date of birth: 21 April 1883 (calculated from WW1 records age at joining 31 years 167 days and date of joining 5 October 1914)
Location of birth: Newcastleton, Hawick, Roxburghshire (WW1 records)
Location of birth: Castleton, Roxburghshire (possible 1891 census)
Location of birth: Scotland (possible 1901 census)
Location of birth: Newcastleton, Roxburghshire (1911 census)
Marriage: Georgina White 19 March 1904 Bellingham, Northumberland; James's Father: blank (I have the certificate)
Date of death: 15 August 1916, France (WW1 records)
Information from WW1 records
Widow of soldier: Georgina Fitzpatrick (Georgina remarried in 1918 to John J Fitzpatrick)
Children of soldier: four born between 1902 and 1912
Father of Soldier: George Forsyth (Stepfather)
Mother of Soldier: Mary Ann Forsyth (Marriage to stepfather - 7 December 1888, Castleton, Roxburghshire, Mary Ann's mother Annie Elliot nee Elliot, Mary Ann's father James Elliot, Mary Ann is described as Spinster)
Half blood brothers/sisters of soldier: two
James Elliot census references:
1891 - RG12, Piece 784, Folio 12, Page 3 - however the age is incorrect by 3 years, but appears to be living with Mary Ann's parents, described as grandson
1901 - RG13, Piece 4840, Folio 12, Page 16 - most likely candidate that I have found
1911 - RG14, Piece 30856 RG78PN1763 RD560 SD1 ED10 SN23
Mary Ann Elliot/Forsyth census references:
1871 - RG10, Piece 784, Folio 12, Page 6 - most likely candidate
1881 - RG11, Piece 5111, Folio 87, Page 6 - most likely candidate
1891 - RG12, Pice 4249, Folio 16, Page 26 - {looks like possible candidate but number children per 1911 census wouldn't work and Robert and George aren't listed on the WW1 records}
1901 - RG13, Piece 4826, Folio 11, Page 14 {looks like possible candidate but number children per 1911 census wouldn't work and Robert and George aren't listed on the WW1 records}
1911 - RG14, Piece 30919 RG78PN1768 RD561 SD2 ED10 {note married 22 years, 4 children, 3 living}
Possible Births I have already got the certificates/Scottish records for:
- Q2 1883 Bellingham, Northumberland - I have the certificate, date of birth 14th April 1883, Mother Betsy Elliot (was Robson), Father James Elliot - struggling to track this family on the census but appears to be incorrect mother's name although the date of birth is only a week out
- 12 July 1883 - James Oliver Elliot, Castleton, Roxburghshire - definitely not this one as he can be tracked to living with his parents in hampshire in 1911
- 3 September 1882 - James Elliot, Newcastleton, Roxburghshire - definitely not this one as he died in 1904 before the date of marriage to Georgina
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