Unconfigured Ad Widget

Collapse

Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Is anyone able to do a look up in Wrexham / Llangollen?

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Is anyone able to do a look up in Wrexham / Llangollen?

    My gt gt gt grandfather was born out of wedlock and seems to be something of an enigma. I am unable to find a birth certificate for him or a record of him in the 1861 census.
    We believe that he was an illegitimate son and I cannot find him on the 1861 census (although I understand that these do not exist anymore for this area?) The 1871 census has him born in Llangollen in 1858 (his grandfather would have put this down). The 1881 census has him born in 1857 in Denbighshire, the 1891 census in Denbigh born in 1854, the 1901 census details him as born in Acrefair, Denbighshire and the 1911 census has him born in Rhosymedre in 1854. As I dont live in the area I am unable to search parish records for him and I am hoping that someone will be able to help me find his true birth year. There is one birth registered in 1853 for ST Asaph, which would tie in with his family as this is where they were from, but not what has been recorded on census... any help gratefully received. Sooz

  • #2
    Originally posted by SoozJackson View Post
    My gt gt gt grandfather was born out of wedlock and seems to be something of an enigma.
    .. his name might help us!
    Elaine







    Comment


    • #3
      Of course - not sure what I was thinking?
      William Kerfoot!

      Comment


      • #4
        Do you know who he married?
        Elaine







        Comment


        • #5
          There are some trees on Ancestry for a William Kerfoot born 1857 Acrefair, Wales - died 14 April 1912 in Blaenau-Ffestiniog, Wales
          Married to Jane Davies 1851 – 1919

          Parents given as Robert Kerfoot (1819 – 1872) and Alice Jones (1833- )
          Can't seem to find a 1861 census to confirm or eliminate this!
          Elaine







          Comment


          • #6
            Sooz,
            I am moving your thread over to our Research forum to see if anyone else can help.

            Until you know which parish to was actually born in it's going to be very difficult for someone to do a lookup for you at the Records Office. We can always move it back to the Research Request forum at a later date when we have a bit more info!
            There are quite a few Welsh parish records now available on Findmypast although not sure how much coverage there is for Denbighshire.
            Elaine







            Comment


            • #7
              Here's a possible birth record

              William Kerfoot
              Date of Registration: Apr-May-Jun 1853
              Registration district: St Asaph
              Inferred County: Denbighshire
              Volume: 11b
              Page: 359

              Comment


              • #8
                Can you give the reference or ancestry link for the 1871 census where you have William with his grandfather?
                Margaret

                Comment


                • #10
                  Thanks Elaine, I couldn't see that one - it's mis-transcribed!
                  Margaret

                  Comment


                  • #11
                    Hi - yep all correct so far... as i mentioned in my original thread there is the birth in St Asaph, which would make complete sense as his family were from around there - specifically farming Marli Farm. However if he was born in St Asaph why would he put Llangollen, acrefair and so on down on the census - it is not like they are close even? He married a widow - Jane Owen who had three children from her first marriage - her husband died in a mining accident. William put on the 1881 census that their surnames were Kerfoot, however they were infact Owen. The couple had 4 more children including my gt grandmother. He is buried in Bethesda Cemetery with his wife, neice and his step daughter Grace Owens. I have a newspaper article saying he was broken hearted - although it is in welsh and I am not a proficient welsh speaker / reader! My confusion remains over where he was born and where was he in 1861 and also where was his father? His grandfather clearly left him and this illegitimate brother and sister money in a will of which I have just double checked and the grandfather leaves them a smaller amount of money than all his other grandchildren - probably because they are illegitimate. His father is Robert Kerfoot as this is stated on his marriage certificate... The tree on ancestry is probably mine! Thank you for looking!

                    Comment


                    • #12
                      findmypast shows a william kerfoot born in st asaph in 1830, but the information does not say which years are covered by findmypast, and there are no more william kerfoot's after him for that parish on fmp.

                      seems they go up to 1846, from looking at kirfoot's christened there.

                      Comment


                      • #13
                        might have to bite the bullet and order the cert.

                        Comment


                        • #14
                          Certs begin half way through 1837 if you mean the 1830 birth kylejustin

                          Edna

                          Comment


                          • #15
                            Sorry you mean the birth in 1850s

                            Nothing found on familysearch only the 1830s birth
                            Edna

                            Comment


                            • #16
                              HI,
                              thankyou for the suggestions.. the only one registered that I can find close is the St Asaph one in the 1850's... so I think I will have to bite the bullet and order the certificate! It is likely to be a relative anyway in that area so it wont be a complete waste! I looked on Familysearch and findmypast and there are some interesting ones on there that I didnt know about so it is all helpful. I just dont get why he would say he was born in Llangollen / Acrefair area if he was born in St Asaph - they is a mystery and may remain one - we will see what the cert brings...
                              Thank you for your help... Sooz

                              Comment


                              • #17
                                it could have been that his mother was visiting someone when she went into labour? maybe he was born there and the family moved when he was a baby, but only remembered where he grew up.
                                Julie
                                They're coming to take me away haha hee hee..........

                                .......I find dead people

                                Comment


                                • #18
                                  On the Ancestry tree (not sure if it's your one) it gives parents as as Robert Kerfoot (1819 – 1872) and Alice Jones (1833- ). If it is your tree, how do you know mother is Alice Jones?
                                  If he was born out of wedlock (again not sure what makes you think this) should you not be looking for a birth registration of William Jones rather than William Kerfoot?
                                  Elaine







                                  Comment


                                  • #19
                                    Originally posted by Elaine ..Spain View Post
                                    On the Ancestry tree (not sure if it's your one) it gives parents as as Robert Kerfoot (1819 – 1872) and Alice Jones (1833- ). If it is your tree, how do you know mother is Alice Jones?
                                    If he was born out of wedlock (again not sure what makes you think this) should you not be looking for a birth registration of William Jones rather than William Kerfoot?
                                    You make a really good point... a search on BMD reveals lots and lots of William Jones in the Wrexham area - not sure what Acrefair would be registered as? I only assume his mother is Alice Jones from the census' following. I have to admit that this side of my family is my mum's baby and she has spent years researching the Kerfoots, my area of interest is my dad's and I am registered with the GOONs for my family name of Gowlett. I just kind of assumed she had made some kind of proper link, she is unfortunately too poorly now to do any more work on it, so I have taken it on with the hope of putting something together for her as she wanted to do!
                                    YOu have made me think carefully about this and it has opened a huge can of worms... William (William's grandfather) left a long and complicated will. I have gone through this carefully and discovered that he only left the first three of Robert's children money. Leaving Robert's other 4 children with nothing and when Robert died Alice Jones was sent to the workhouse with those four children... why would he do this - when he left large sums of money to all his other grandchildren individaully named each with conditions attached to them? The plot thickens! There is also no marriage recorded in the right area at the right time for Robert at all? Not sure which tree you looked at on ancestry - its the JoshJackson 'mums tree' one?
                                    I am not at all sure now how to proceed...
                                    Fact is I have a William Kerfoot (so named on census collections) born sometime in the middle of 1850's. I know when he married / died and where he is buried! I know his father is Robert and he has two siblings and that all three were illegitimate! So how do I go any further or is it a brick wall that I am just going to be unable to break down! Thank you for your help...

                                    Comment


                                    • #20
                                      As you say, there are a lot of William Jones in the Wrexham BMDs! (According to Genuki I think you will find Acrefair/Rhosymedre come under Wrexham).

                                      Fact is I have a William Kerfoot (so named on census collections) born sometime in the middle of 1850's. I know when he married / died and where he is buried! I know his father is Robert and he has two siblings and that all three were illegitimate!
                                      Sorry to ask again, I may have missed something, but how do you know that William and two siblings were illegitimate.

                                      I have gone through this carefully and discovered that he only left the first three of Robert's children money. Leaving Robert's other 4 children with nothing and when Robert died Alice Jones was sent to the workhouse with those four children... why would he do this -
                                      It almost sounds as if Alice was not the mother of the first three children ??

                                      Not sure which tree I was looking at on Ancestry but will see if I can find your tree to see if anything useful jumps out at me!
                                      Elaine







                                      Comment

                                      Working...
                                      X