Help with Ellen Elvin & Thomas Read

[jillmyo]

I am absolutely at the end of my !!!!! Thomas Read born 1812 is my G.G. Grandfather and I am trying to find information on his first wife who is my G.G. Grandmother. He married Ellen Elvin and had 7 children first born 1842 and the last born 1854. He was in the army 5th reg of foot Colour Sergeant. He next married Dinah in 1859 (I have the wedding certificate) and had 4 children first 1860 and last 1865. WOW he seems to have been very busy!! I have the birth certificates for 4 of the children from first marriage and that is the only way I know first wife's name. I cannot find any birth certificate for Ellen as she was born Barbados British National, and I cannot find a marriage certificate. Thomas Read was born in Liverpool. I have been looking now for 3 years, and now totally bemused. If there is anyone to help I will be eternally grateful. thank you (in great anticipation)

[kylejustin]

i suppose the army records dont mention his first marriage?

[jillmyo]

No there seems to be no mention of her except on childrens birth certificates and on 1851 census when the surname is spelt incorrectly as Reid. Have looked under this spelling as well with no joy.

[Darksecretz]

Hello Jill,

do you have Ellens death certificate at all? do you know what yr she was born at all?

[jillmyo]

Hi Julie, no I don't know when she was born I can't find out anything about her except she is listed at the mother and wife but no dates of birth or death or marriage. A total mystery to me.

[Katarzyna]

This will be them on 1851 census
HO107 1611, 474, 20

http://search.ancestry.co.uk/iexec?htx=view&r=5538&dbid=8860&iid=KENHO107_1611_1611-0527&fn=Thomas&ln=Reid&st=r&ssrc=&pid=1453371

as Reid

[jillmyo]

Hi Kat, I have them on the 1851 but it is Ellen's birth, marriage and death info I can't find.

[Elaine ..Spain]

When and where was the last child of Ellen and Thomas born?

[jillmyo]

Hi Elaine, The last child is John born in 1854 in Beverley Yorkshire

[Anne in Carlisle]

If Ellen was born in Barbados and Thomas came from Liverpool (a big port!) is it possible he was at sea and met her there? They may have married there or just not bothered.

Anne

[Katarzyna]

Hi Kat, I have them on the 1851 but it is Ellen's birth, marriage and death info I can't find.

Yep, I realised that, just wanted a picture of who and where they were they didn't half move about a bit didn't they? The children born all over the country. Do you have them on the 41 census? The first child (that we know of) b 1842 Hull.
Did his Army records give dates and places so we can pinpoint Ellen's possible place of marriage and death.

When he remarried did his cert say he was a widower - he may have been divorced?
Ellen's last child b 1854 Beverley,Yorkshire - where did he marry Dinah in 1859?

[jillmyo]

Thanks Anne, I have had similar thoughts. Thomas was in the Army and his wedding certificate for his second marriage states he was a widower and at that time in 1859 he was a Chelsea Pensioner and Publican.

[jillmyo]

Yep, I realised that, just wanted a picture of who and where they were they didn't half move about a bit didn't they? The children born all over the country. Do you have them on the 41 census? The first child (that we know of) b 1842 Hull.
Did his Army records give dates and places so we can pinpoint Ellen's possible place of marriage and death.

When he remarried did his cert say he was a widower - he may have been divorced?
Ellen's last child b 1854 Beverley,Yorkshire - where did he marry Dinah in 1859?

He married Dinah August 17th 1859 and he was a widower. They married in Walton on the Hill Liverpool, and at that time he was a publican. Dinah came from Kirkdale, Liverpool so I would think he had been back in Liverpool after Ellens death.He was 24 years older than 2nd wife so I have sort of wondered if she may have been a nurse or housekeeper, maybe he needed someone to look after all the children (typical man!) he went on to have 4 more children with 2nd wife. I can't find any notes on army records as to why he was discharged.

[Katarzyna]

His service records show he served in Mauritious for 1 1/2yrs and Mediterranean for 9 1/2 yrs no dates so not much help:(
I searched overseas marriages on FMP but nothing there.

Have you considerd this death for Ellen?
Ellen Mary Reid
Liverpool 8b 94
Jan-Feb-Mar 1857


or Helen Read
Malton 9d 233
Jul-Aug-Sep 1857

Malton is north of Beverley but not the reg district for Beverley which would have be Holderness at that time. Can't see any likely deaths in that district.

[Darksecretz]

just as a side thought Kat, have you looked for an Eleanor Reid/Read/Rhead/Rhede?

[Darksecretz]

He married Dinah August 17th 1859

oooh thats my wedding anniversary too....

[jillmyo]

oooh thats my wedding anniversary too....

You are doing extremely well for your age!!!Julie

[Katarzyna]

just as a side thought Kat, have you looked for an Eleanor Reid/Read/Rhead/Rhede?

Not Eleanor, Julie, no. I did all without Christian name Did those above plus Rede and Redd.

[Darksecretz]

You are doing extremely well for your age!!!Julie

LOL!! I meant the date not the year...lol (though me bones DO creak alot) :smilee:

[Darksecretz]

Not Eleanor, Julie, no. I did all without Christian name Did those above plus Rede and Redd.

poop! she is certainly one tricky person isnt she?