About teh military records and my elusive gg grandaddy's many names and ages

[BendyCowgirl]

I typed in John William Gardiner and two possible matches came up but the enlistment dates are way too late for him...1896 and 1895 by which time he was married and living in Cardiff with two teenage sons (g gradaddy Jo and gg uncle Fred). Yet there is another 'date' column...what's all that about...they are 1878 and 1877 which is more along the lines of when he would have been enlisted. Could somebody enlighten moi

[Little Nell]

Typed it in where?

[KiteRunner]

I think that could be the year of birth.

[KiteRunner]

This is the record that Phoenix found - probably the direct link won't work so I will tell you how to get to it.
The National Archives | DocumentsOnline | Image Details

If that link doesn't work, use this one to get to TNA:
The National Archives | DocumentsOnline

Click on "What else is available?"
Scroll down to the Navy section and find Registers of Seamen's Services (ADM 139, ADM 188), click to search and put in first name John William, surname Gardiner and you should get 3 results. It's the third one, born Pimlico 1855.

[BendyCowgirl]

That coudl be him actually come to think of it. I tried the DOB estimator and it put him at that date. How does it work though just by going on how old they were on the census? Ooh that means he did tell fibs about his age *giggles* like gg grandfaher like gg granddaughter.

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

The direct link works for me. The age on that naval record is exactly right, isn't it (04 April 1855)?? Comparing to his two census records, rather than the marriage cert.

[BendyCowgirl]

It seems as accurate as poss...maybe it's worth taking a gamble. Was wondering though...how do they work out ages from the census with that age estimator?

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

On ancestry they just deduct the age the person said from the census year. This isn't very accurate. Let's say it's the 1871 census which from memory was taken 2nd April 1871. If a person says they were 30 ancestry says they were born in 1841. However their date of birth might be as early as 3rd April 1840 through to 2nd April 1841. Obviously accuracy also depends on people giving their correct age, which they often didn't!

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

I notice there's no birth reg fo him, but not all births were registered. I wonder if he had a different surname when he was a child, hence his apparent non-appearence on the earlier censuses?

[BendyCowgirl]

...

I notice there's no birth reg fo him, but not all births were registered. I wonder if he had a different surname when he was a child, hence his apparent non-appearence on the earlier censuses?

I wouldn't have thought so. I can se no logical reason. Unless you can? His father was named as William Gardiner on the marr cert. Are we sure the guy on the military record is him then?


BTW am I being slow but I still don't know how the DOB estimator on here works.

[KiteRunner]

The DOB estimator on here just calculates the likely period in which somebody was born from the ages given on the censuses or any other info you put in. It doesn't do anything that you can't do yourself from the same data.

If you want to know whether the navy record belongs to your John William Gardiner or not then your best best is going to be to pay to download it and see what it says.

If someone did have a different surname as a child (e.g. illegitimate and / or took stepfather's surname) then you will often find that the father's name on their marriage certificate isn't the actual name of their father. Either they didn't want to mention the fact that they were illegitimate, or they didn't fully explain their father's name to the vicar or registrar and thus a wrong assumption was made.

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Sorry, I didn't realise you meant the age estimator on here!

As we can't find him in the earlier censues that could be because he wasn't born where/when he thought he was and so different info is given when he was with his parents, leading us not to spot him. Alternatively, if his father was no longer living (I know the marriage cert doesn't say father dec'd, but that doesn't mean he wasn't!) then his mum might have remarried and whilst she had her Gardiner children at home, they went by their step-dad's surname. Then when he left home he reverted to his "real" name.

I've seen this time and time again.........

(doesn't mean that has the be the answer though! lol)

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Oops, and Kate's answer as well! (didn't read that properly!)

[BendyCowgirl]

...

Ooh, no actually his dad had died by the time he got married...the cert did say, sorry did'nt I mentioned that?

Will there be anything on that military record then to confirm either way who he is do you think? This is doing me 'ed in I think I'm going to ring my uncle see if he can tell me anything...anything at all.

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

Will there be anything on that military record then to confirm either way who he is do you think?

You won't know unless you buy it! lol

[Merry Monty Montgomery]

sorry did'nt I mentioned that?

Sorry, I can't remember - you probably did!